Low-buck 103 build questions
Thread Starter
|
Tourer
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 383
Likes: 4
From: Seattle
Low-buck 103 build questions
My aim is to do a low-buck 103 build using the below parts. I already own everything below, except the pistons.
SE103 piston kit
.030 head gasket
Andrews TW54H cams
Dynojet Powervision
Fuel Moto AC kit
Stock '09 head pipes
V&H Monster Rounds
Tune: Would a Woods TW-555 tune be a reasonable place to start for a base tune? I will follow up with Fuel Moto to see if they have a 54H tune, if not, the 54H/TW555 specs look fairly close to me.
Heads: I'd like to massage the heads a little, nothing radical, I want to keep port velocity high. Have not decided if I'll do a little myself, or turn over to a pro. Anyone have any links to some TC head porting info?
Exhaust: I'm sure a 2-1 pipe would be pretty ideal with this combination, but I have not seen any direct comparisons using 103/54H. Most seem to feel the 54H has enough down low even with true duals, others don't.
Decking: How far in the hole are the SE103 pistons typically?
Compression: With roughly 10.2:1 and the 54H, how easy will this be on the starter? Should I consider compression releases?
Thanks in advance
SE103 piston kit
.030 head gasket
Andrews TW54H cams
Dynojet Powervision
Fuel Moto AC kit
Stock '09 head pipes
V&H Monster Rounds
Tune: Would a Woods TW-555 tune be a reasonable place to start for a base tune? I will follow up with Fuel Moto to see if they have a 54H tune, if not, the 54H/TW555 specs look fairly close to me.
Heads: I'd like to massage the heads a little, nothing radical, I want to keep port velocity high. Have not decided if I'll do a little myself, or turn over to a pro. Anyone have any links to some TC head porting info?
Exhaust: I'm sure a 2-1 pipe would be pretty ideal with this combination, but I have not seen any direct comparisons using 103/54H. Most seem to feel the 54H has enough down low even with true duals, others don't.
Decking: How far in the hole are the SE103 pistons typically?
Compression: With roughly 10.2:1 and the 54H, how easy will this be on the starter? Should I consider compression releases?
Thanks in advance
Thread Starter
|
Tourer
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 383
Likes: 4
From: Seattle
Not sure how big a deal the extra 2 cubes per cylinder are. I'll do more research, you might have a good point, pistons prices I've found are $159.96 (SE103) & $313.99 (CP 107).
Road Captain
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 531
Likes: 4
From: Chile Flats, AZ
Imho
My aim is to do a low-buck 103 build using the below parts. I already own everything below, except the pistons.
SE103 piston kit
.030 head gasket
Andrews TW54H cams
Dynojet Powervision
Fuel Moto AC kit
Stock '09 head pipes
V&H Monster Rounds
Tune: Would a Woods TW-555 tune be a reasonable place to start for a base tune? I will follow up with Fuel Moto to see if they have a 54H tune, if not, the 54H/TW555 specs look fairly close to me.
Heads: I'd like to massage the heads a little, nothing radical, I want to keep port velocity high. Have not decided if I'll do a little myself, or turn over to a pro. Anyone have any links to some TC head porting info?
Exhaust: I'm sure a 2-1 pipe would be pretty ideal with this combination, but I have not seen any direct comparisons using 103/54H. Most seem to feel the 54H has enough down low even with true duals, others don't.
Decking: How far in the hole are the SE103 pistons typically?
Compression: With roughly 10.2:1 and the 54H, how easy will this be on the starter? Should I consider compression releases?
Thanks in advance
SE103 piston kit
.030 head gasket
Andrews TW54H cams
Dynojet Powervision
Fuel Moto AC kit
Stock '09 head pipes
V&H Monster Rounds
Tune: Would a Woods TW-555 tune be a reasonable place to start for a base tune? I will follow up with Fuel Moto to see if they have a 54H tune, if not, the 54H/TW555 specs look fairly close to me.
Heads: I'd like to massage the heads a little, nothing radical, I want to keep port velocity high. Have not decided if I'll do a little myself, or turn over to a pro. Anyone have any links to some TC head porting info?
Exhaust: I'm sure a 2-1 pipe would be pretty ideal with this combination, but I have not seen any direct comparisons using 103/54H. Most seem to feel the 54H has enough down low even with true duals, others don't.
Decking: How far in the hole are the SE103 pistons typically?
Compression: With roughly 10.2:1 and the 54H, how easy will this be on the starter? Should I consider compression releases?
Thanks in advance
Tune The FM '555' was close to mine (54h); and a few AT and DL runs (took more than it should because I was messing with slipon changes) it was dialed in pretty well.
The last three days of AT/DL my VEs have not changed at all.
Exhaust I'm running KA TDs; doesn't tune as perfectly as some PV maps I've seen; I've run a few 2:1s, but I wanted TDs on this one.
Compression put in the CRs; cheap insurance against starter problems.
Of course I'm only 2500' feet here; and ride alot down to 1200'. For the desert heat, it was a no brainer for me.
Others'll chime in with their opinion/experiences. Good luck.
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 6,129
Likes: 143
From: Santa Cruz
I did SE103 cast pistons, 54h, ACRs, PCV, stock heads (and gaskets), and header with Fatshoz slip-ons (16 disc, open caps), Ness A/C on my '09 last June. The original map sucked, it is better with some autotune use, but I'm gonna get it dynoed soon. Even so it runs pretty good. Rented a stock 103 for ten days in October and my bike will seriously blow the stocker away! It maybe could run a little better up top with headwork but I think it is a great bang for the buck as is. With a PV even better. Yes do the compression releases, especially if ya are going with the .030 gaskets. Good luck!
Last edited by 0ldhippie; Jan 12, 2013 at 11:13 PM.
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,561
Likes: 280
From: North Cental Iowa
I have almost the same build, very happy with it. I found the SE pistons on ebay for $115 so it was a no brainer for me. I know the 107 build is the latest & greatest, but I can't see spending the extra $$ for another 3 or 4 HP, especially since the new cranks are so crappy. I'd say put the money toward some head work if anything, I just went with a good multi-angle valve job since the bike had 48K on it. Fuel Moto sent me a tune, they don't use 54s so I'm not sure what it was for, it wasn't too bad maybe a little too much timing, My pistons were down in the hole about .008-.010 so I figure the comp is about 9.9-10.0, talked to the Cometic rep & he said you can special order .027 HGs, they'll raise CR up about .06. I went with comp releases just because of the compensator issues, going to do SE comp this winter, as JetD said they're pretty cheap insurance. Good luck, should be a good build.
Last edited by DTTJGlide; Jan 12, 2013 at 11:31 PM.
Thread Starter
|
Tourer
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 383
Likes: 4
From: Seattle
Thanks guys, that's encouraging.
DTTJ, the flakey cranks worry me as well, good friends with a local Indy shop, he's repaired a number of scissored cranks in hot-rodded TC's.
DTTJ, the flakey cranks worry me as well, good friends with a local Indy shop, he's repaired a number of scissored cranks in hot-rodded TC's.
Trending Topics
Road Warrior
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,960
Likes: 1
From: Miami, FL
You could leave the 103 as is with heads and a solid cam and call it a day and have an easy to tune reliable motor, at the end of the day it's about your budget and what you want.
But if you do heads and cams on the 103, and it gets boring you're going bigger later anyways.
If you go 107 with stock heads you still have options down the road...........
The best thing to do is get with your builder, but in this day in age with how affordable the bigger kits have become (especially if you bore out your cylinders) it doesn't make sense to me to start changing pistons and what not on a 103 for a street bike.
Again just my $0.02, I'm not an expert or engine builder, but I have been looking at this for a loooooong time myself.
HD Forum Stories
The Best of Harley-Davidson for Lifelong Riders
7 Times Harley-Davidson Chucked Tradition Out the Window
Verdad Gallardo
7 Surprising Harley-Davidson Products that Are Not Motorcycles
Verdad Gallardo
8 Best Harley-Davidson Motorcycles Ever
Pouria Savadkouei
10 Worst Harley-Davidson Motorcycles Ever
Pouria Savadkouei
Killer Custom's Jail Break Is The Breakout That Refused to Blend In
Verdad Gallardo
Crazy Bunderbike Build Looks Amazing, But Is It Impossible to Ride?
Verdad Gallardo
Harley-Davidson Reveals Super Cool Cafe Racer Concept
Verdad Gallardo
Engraved Rebellion: Inside Bundnerbike's Glam Rock II
Verdad Gallardo
10 Motorcycles You Should Never Buy
Joe Kucinski
Thread Starter
|
Tourer
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 383
Likes: 4
From: Seattle
Which leads me back to what I was saying, if you're going to hop up the 103 going as far as piston and do the crank, might as well go bigger. The bigger bore will bring TQ in a greater quantity earlier, remember not to just look at peak numbers.
You could leave the 103 as is with heads and a solid cam and call it a day and have an easy to tune reliable motor, at the end of the day it's about your budget and what you want.
But if you do heads and cams on the 103, and it gets boring you're going bigger later anyways.
If you go 107 with stock heads you still have options down the road...........
The best thing to do is get with your builder, but in this day in age with how affordable the bigger kits have become (especially if you bore out your cylinders) it doesn't make sense to me to start changing pistons and what not on a 103 for a street bike.
Again just my $0.02, I'm not an expert or engine builder, but I have been looking at this for a loooooong time myself.
You could leave the 103 as is with heads and a solid cam and call it a day and have an easy to tune reliable motor, at the end of the day it's about your budget and what you want.
But if you do heads and cams on the 103, and it gets boring you're going bigger later anyways.
If you go 107 with stock heads you still have options down the road...........
The best thing to do is get with your builder, but in this day in age with how affordable the bigger kits have become (especially if you bore out your cylinders) it doesn't make sense to me to start changing pistons and what not on a 103 for a street bike.
Again just my $0.02, I'm not an expert or engine builder, but I have been looking at this for a loooooong time myself.
I'm aware that adding cubes will push the torque curve down (given the same cam), I just haven't decided if the 2 extra cubes per bank are worth the extra $150 or so extra dollars. If it's an 2-3 ft lbs at a given RPM, I would say not. If it means the same performance as the 10.2:1 103 at an easier cranking 9.8:1, then absolutely worth it. Not sure what your saying about the crank, I have no plans to touch it. Thanks for your comments, kicking around different ideas is why I came here.
Road Warrior
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,960
Likes: 1
From: Miami, FL
I've got quite a bit of experience building hot-rods, it's very easy to let a build escalate out of control from your original objectives. I'm the one planning this build and doing the work. The objective on this is to screw together something that's affordable, reliable, and fun to ride.
I'm aware that adding cubes will push the torque curve down (given the same cam), I just haven't decided if the 2 extra cubes per bank are worth the extra $150 or so extra dollars. If it's an 2-3 ft lbs at a given RPM, I would say not. If it means the same performance as the 10.2:1 103 at an easier cranking 9.8:1, then absolutely worth it. Not sure what your saying about the crank, I have no plans to touch it. Thanks for your comments, kicking around different ideas is why I came here.
I'm aware that adding cubes will push the torque curve down (given the same cam), I just haven't decided if the 2 extra cubes per bank are worth the extra $150 or so extra dollars. If it's an 2-3 ft lbs at a given RPM, I would say not. If it means the same performance as the 10.2:1 103 at an easier cranking 9.8:1, then absolutely worth it. Not sure what your saying about the crank, I have no plans to touch it. Thanks for your comments, kicking around different ideas is why I came here.
And yes 100% these builds can escalate too much. If you're wrenching yourself, there's a lot more options to keep costs down.
First off, how much power do you want and where?
You can simply bolt in a set of cams and call it good.
If not, there are a lot of guys you can send your heads to like Don dorfman of Dewey's, Frank @ Drago's, John Sachs, Kirby @ Vee Twin, who can help you out and not break the bank for a "mild" build. You can easily get around 100HP and 110+ TQ from a mild cam and heads ported to match, and be well under $1K for the budget turning your own wrenches.
A set of Tman 555 TQ cams and a street port job will square you away good and pull like a freight train.
Like was mentioned, Bob has a set of Andrew's 54's for sale in the classifieds for a dirt cheap price, if someone doesn't get those soon they're gonna end up in my bike, lol.
If you want to do the heads, then best to go with what whomever is doing the work suggest for a cam, because it will be something familiar to them and tried and true. At the end of the day, only a limited amount of people "really" make the cams, different names get put on the boxes. You'd be better off with a well matched head/cam combo than the newest and greatest thing and trying to get a map that's close.......
Since you say you're on a budget also, you need to weigh the cost of the headwork, to how much it's going to give you over just the cams, and see if it's worth it to you.
Lot's of cams out there will still get you close to 90HP/100+ TQ, so is the $400+ for heads worth the extra gains for you.
Again, just my $0.02 on the information I have found and learned from along the way.
FM