Stage 1 Recalibration FACTS inside
Road Master
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,021
Likes: 2
Because the apative ability isn't based off the NBO2 value. It is based off the the amount of fuel the ECM had to add or take away to get reach the targeted voltage of the NBO2. Those values are stored in memory and adjustments are made to final fuel calulations.
Road Warrior
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,739
Likes: 10
From: Suffolk, England
A think there is a bunch of confusion around what the EFI system can and cannot cope with in terms of hardware changes. My only input to this is that I understand something fundamental changed in '09.
Prior to '09 its fair to say there is a body of measured evidence that if you put on a high-flow A/C and pipes with no adjustment to the EFI then the AFR shifted to leaner; typically the closed-loop AFR at certain loads/RPMs shifted from around 14.6/14.7:1 to 15:1 or leaner, depending on the hardware used. Similar changes occured to open-loop.
Since '09, however, something changed. I dunno what but two HD dealers told me that stage-1 downloads are no longer needed on new bikes; you can put an SE A/C and SE mufflers on and the EFI will manage the change. Now, if these dealers had said the opposite, that more money needs to be spent, I'd be cynical, but these people are saying that you don't have to spend the extra on the stage-1 download as it adds nothing i.e. you will end up with the same EPA-compliant AFRs as before. This might not be great from a stage-1 perspective and you will be leaving power on the table but it does imply you won't be doing any harm either.
I dunno what changed though. Different software, different sensors, different ECU completely, all three?
Prior to '09 its fair to say there is a body of measured evidence that if you put on a high-flow A/C and pipes with no adjustment to the EFI then the AFR shifted to leaner; typically the closed-loop AFR at certain loads/RPMs shifted from around 14.6/14.7:1 to 15:1 or leaner, depending on the hardware used. Similar changes occured to open-loop.
Since '09, however, something changed. I dunno what but two HD dealers told me that stage-1 downloads are no longer needed on new bikes; you can put an SE A/C and SE mufflers on and the EFI will manage the change. Now, if these dealers had said the opposite, that more money needs to be spent, I'd be cynical, but these people are saying that you don't have to spend the extra on the stage-1 download as it adds nothing i.e. you will end up with the same EPA-compliant AFRs as before. This might not be great from a stage-1 perspective and you will be leaving power on the table but it does imply you won't be doing any harm either.
I dunno what changed though. Different software, different sensors, different ECU completely, all three?
Tourer
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 302
Likes: 8
From: Huddersfield. U.K.
A think there is a bunch of confusion around what the EFI system can and cannot cope with in terms of hardware changes. My only input to this is that I understand something fundamental changed in '09.
Prior to '09 its fair to say there is a body of measured evidence that if you put on a high-flow A/C and pipes with no adjustment to the EFI then the AFR shifted to leaner; typically the closed-loop AFR at certain loads/RPMs shifted from around 14.6/14.7:1 to 15:1 or leaner, depending on the hardware used. Similar changes occured to open-loop.
Since '09, however, something changed. I dunno what but two HD dealers told me that stage-1 downloads are no longer needed on new bikes; you can put an SE A/C and SE mufflers on and the EFI will manage the change. Now, if these dealers had said the opposite, that more money needs to be spent, I'd be cynical, but these people are saying that you don't have to spend the extra on the stage-1 download as it adds nothing i.e. you will end up with the same EPA-compliant AFRs as before. This might not be great from a stage-1 perspective and you will be leaving power on the table but it does imply you won't be doing any harm either.
I dunno what changed though. Different software, different sensors, different ECU completely, all three?
Prior to '09 its fair to say there is a body of measured evidence that if you put on a high-flow A/C and pipes with no adjustment to the EFI then the AFR shifted to leaner; typically the closed-loop AFR at certain loads/RPMs shifted from around 14.6/14.7:1 to 15:1 or leaner, depending on the hardware used. Similar changes occured to open-loop.
Since '09, however, something changed. I dunno what but two HD dealers told me that stage-1 downloads are no longer needed on new bikes; you can put an SE A/C and SE mufflers on and the EFI will manage the change. Now, if these dealers had said the opposite, that more money needs to be spent, I'd be cynical, but these people are saying that you don't have to spend the extra on the stage-1 download as it adds nothing i.e. you will end up with the same EPA-compliant AFRs as before. This might not be great from a stage-1 perspective and you will be leaving power on the table but it does imply you won't be doing any harm either.
I dunno what changed though. Different software, different sensors, different ECU completely, all three?
Road Captain
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 560
Likes: 10
From: Livermore, CA
I feel that stage 1 upgrades, air cleaner and mufflers don't change the volume of air that the 96 can pump enough to necessitate a open loop power enrichment change. The twin cam motor is limited mostly by cam and head flow, stage one upgrades might add 5% to 8%. Under closed loop the system can definately compensate for stage 1 with the O2 sensor fuel trims. Under open loop the factory calibration is a safely rich mixture that will also support stage 1 upgrades unless you are doing something totally extreme with your bike like towing a trailer up a mountain grade wide open for 10 minutes at a time or running 87 octane. Once you significantly change the air that the engine can pump either with a displacement change, cam change or head work the open loop power enrichment and closed loop VE tables need to be altered for safe running.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 5,977
Likes: 85
From: Nevada
I feel that stage 1 upgrades, air cleaner and mufflers don't change the volume of air that the 96 can pump enough to necessitate a open loop power enrichment change. The twin cam motor is limited mostly by cam and head flow, stage one upgrades might add 5% to 8%. Under closed loop the system can definately compensate for stage 1 with the O2 sensor fuel trims. Under open loop the factory calibration is a safely rich mixture that will also support stage 1 upgrades unless you are doing something totally extreme with your bike like towing a trailer up a mountain grade wide open for 10 minutes at a time or running 87 octane. Once you significantly change the air that the engine can pump either with a displacement change, cam change or head work the open loop power enrichment and closed loop VE tables need to be altered for safe running.
Road Captain
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 560
Likes: 10
From: Livermore, CA
Xieds are the cheap, easy and safe way to deal with cooling down a stock and stage 1 bike.
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Joe Kucinski
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 5,977
Likes: 85
From: Nevada
Many riders are happy with them. I wonder if they add enough fuel to cool sufficiently?