Red hot head pipe
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,325
Likes: 7
From: SE Illinois
I idled mine in my shop for about 3-4 minutes yesterday messing with something else...pipes looked the same as cold. Revved her a few times before shutting it down & pipes still looked the same.
I have a good dyno tune though, however I would think that with your XiEDs you would be plenty rich enough to keep it from getting that hot.
My suggestion would be to pull the plugs and have a look....color of the plugs should tell you a lot. Black/sooty=rich, white/burnt=lean, chocolate/tan=just right.
I have a good dyno tune though, however I would think that with your XiEDs you would be plenty rich enough to keep it from getting that hot.
My suggestion would be to pull the plugs and have a look....color of the plugs should tell you a lot. Black/sooty=rich, white/burnt=lean, chocolate/tan=just right.
+1 the Xied's have yielded mixed results. that is the main reason i do not run them on customer bikes, i would rather put a tuner in there where it gives me some control. your pipes should never glow.
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,325
Likes: 7
From: SE Illinois
They are simply a resistor that fools the ECM into thinking the bike is running lean which causes it to richen the mixture. I'm thinking if they would fail it does not cut out, but would revert to standard output, which would result in stock AFR?
Never ran them on a big twin, but did on a Sporty once with good results (for what it is).
Thread Starter
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Tourer
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 290
Likes: 0
From: MX/AZ/NV
The "junk" you see on the threads is anti-seize lube.
To my eye, they look a bit on the white side but not excessive. You be the judge.
But now I am struggling with......wouldn't the plugs show some signs of "lean" and white by the virtue that the engine got very hot....including inside the chambers?
Maybe my thought processes are going nuts here, but it seems logical that if the chamber temps were HOT.....so would that heating transfer to the plugs and give them that "white" or "lean" appearance with no over the road cooling effects.
I did neglect to say I have changed out the plugs very recently and this is the first time idling in the garage with the "blips" tossed in.
I have idled the engine before on the old plugs and there was no red hot syndrome.
Or I just never noticed.....
I replaced the OEM plugs with NGK DCPR7E.
The original OEM plugs looked perfecto on removal. Tan in color.
I was 100% satisfied with the Xied setup and the performance with overall running attitudes....at all speeds.
Unless that Xeid can suddenly and without warning take a dump and not provide the richer mixture to keep the temps down.
I will contact Nightrider and ask them if that Xeid can suddenly take a dump and if there is a way to test the continuity.
Thanks for your help.....really
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,325
Likes: 7
From: SE Illinois
Plugs look very new....now I see you recently changed them. Can't tell much because of that, but nothing out of the ordinary.
If your old plugs looked good when you changed them & you were running on the XiEDs, then I would say they were doing their job. That still doesn't rule out one of them taking a dump on you...continue to investigate. Worst case scenario....buy 2 new ones & replace them. It's only $100.
If your old plugs looked good when you changed them & you were running on the XiEDs, then I would say they were doing their job. That still doesn't rule out one of them taking a dump on you...continue to investigate. Worst case scenario....buy 2 new ones & replace them. It's only $100.
Following your suggestion, I pulled both plugs. See attached photos.
The "junk" you see on the threads is anti-seize lube.
To my eye, they look a bit on the white side but not excessive. You be the judge.
But now I am struggling with......wouldn't the plugs show some signs of "lean" and white by the virtue that the engine got very hot....including inside the chambers?
Maybe my thought processes are going nuts here, but it seems logical that if the chamber temps were HOT.....so would that heating transfer to the plugs and give them that "white" or "lean" appearance with no over the road cooling effects.
I did neglect to say I have changed out the plugs very recently and this is the first time idling in the garage with the "blips" tossed in.
I have idled the engine before on the old plugs and there was no red hot syndrome.
Or I just never noticed.....
I replaced the OEM plugs with NGK DCPR7E.
The original OEM plugs looked perfecto on removal. Tan in color.
I was 100% satisfied with the Xied setup and the performance with overall running attitudes....at all speeds.
Unless that Xeid can suddenly and without warning take a dump and not provide the richer mixture to keep the temps down.
I will contact Nightrider and ask them if that Xeid can suddenly take a dump and if there is a way to test the continuity.
Thanks for your help.....really
The "junk" you see on the threads is anti-seize lube.
To my eye, they look a bit on the white side but not excessive. You be the judge.
But now I am struggling with......wouldn't the plugs show some signs of "lean" and white by the virtue that the engine got very hot....including inside the chambers?
Maybe my thought processes are going nuts here, but it seems logical that if the chamber temps were HOT.....so would that heating transfer to the plugs and give them that "white" or "lean" appearance with no over the road cooling effects.
I did neglect to say I have changed out the plugs very recently and this is the first time idling in the garage with the "blips" tossed in.
I have idled the engine before on the old plugs and there was no red hot syndrome.
Or I just never noticed.....
I replaced the OEM plugs with NGK DCPR7E.
The original OEM plugs looked perfecto on removal. Tan in color.
I was 100% satisfied with the Xied setup and the performance with overall running attitudes....at all speeds.
Unless that Xeid can suddenly and without warning take a dump and not provide the richer mixture to keep the temps down.
I will contact Nightrider and ask them if that Xeid can suddenly take a dump and if there is a way to test the continuity.
Thanks for your help.....really
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 2,325
Likes: 7
From: SE Illinois
Another suggestion I might add....change back to the 6R12 OEM plugs.
Long detailed explanation cut short...the NGK plugs have different resistance, and can change your ignition timing. This can cause your FI bike to throw codes, and also could change the timing enough to cause additional heat. Not saying this is your problem, but it could cause some issues.
There's a lot of info out there on this & I don't want to change the topic, but it's worth researching..
You've never had this problem before, you changed plugs to a different brand with different resistance, now you have this problem....I would change back to OEM plugs & see if it changes anything before I went any further.
Long detailed explanation cut short...the NGK plugs have different resistance, and can change your ignition timing. This can cause your FI bike to throw codes, and also could change the timing enough to cause additional heat. Not saying this is your problem, but it could cause some issues.
There's a lot of info out there on this & I don't want to change the topic, but it's worth researching..
You've never had this problem before, you changed plugs to a different brand with different resistance, now you have this problem....I would change back to OEM plugs & see if it changes anything before I went any further.
Thread Starter
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Tourer
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 290
Likes: 0
From: MX/AZ/NV
Thanks everyone...
This is now WAY over my pay grade.
I have made an appointment with an Indy for diagnosis and/or any tune/dyno work involved.
I was on the phone for nearly an hour with Nightrider, of Xeid fame, and he was very helpful and offered to send me another devise in the unlikely event of failure.
He got WAY over my head with this, in typical engineer fashion, and that is when I made the call to get it professionally looked at.
Bottom line is I will not risk melting an engine, in the unlikely event the Xeid has taken a dump.
Again.....thanks very much for everyone's input.
This is now WAY over my pay grade.
I have made an appointment with an Indy for diagnosis and/or any tune/dyno work involved.
I was on the phone for nearly an hour with Nightrider, of Xeid fame, and he was very helpful and offered to send me another devise in the unlikely event of failure.
He got WAY over my head with this, in typical engineer fashion, and that is when I made the call to get it professionally looked at.
Bottom line is I will not risk melting an engine, in the unlikely event the Xeid has taken a dump.
Again.....thanks very much for everyone's input.
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Thread Starter
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Tourer
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 290
Likes: 0
From: MX/AZ/NV
Another suggestion I might add....change back to the 6R12 OEM plugs.
Long detailed explanation cut short...the NGK plugs have different resistance, and can change your ignition timing. This can cause your FI bike to throw codes, and also could change the timing enough to cause additional heat. Not saying this is your problem, but it could cause some issues.
There's a lot of info out there on this & I don't want to change the topic, but it's worth researching..
You've never had this problem before, you changed plugs to a different brand with different resistance, now you have this problem....I would change back to OEM plugs & see if it changes anything before I went any further.
Long detailed explanation cut short...the NGK plugs have different resistance, and can change your ignition timing. This can cause your FI bike to throw codes, and also could change the timing enough to cause additional heat. Not saying this is your problem, but it could cause some issues.
There's a lot of info out there on this & I don't want to change the topic, but it's worth researching..
You've never had this problem before, you changed plugs to a different brand with different resistance, now you have this problem....I would change back to OEM plugs & see if it changes anything before I went any further.
Your call on the what is going on is right on.
I was right in the middle of putting back in the OEM plugs like you said, but with my "all thumbs" syndrome in full gear....I dropped one and it broke the tip off. Sheet!!
So that is out, as I don't have another set and it's 700 miles to San Diego at the local H-D dealer.
Surely there has to be scads of guys who have changed out from OEM to a NGK plug.
In the furtherance of our knowledge base, I would be interested to hear of any similar problems with using a non OEM plug.