Twin Cam Warm idle Knock
Thread Starter
|
Novice
Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 16
Likes: 1
From: Richfield Springs, NY
To Jbarr's post, the early '99 TC cam plates are the ones that require plugging a port.
I have never seen a push rod worn like the one on the left side of the OPs photo. Just a couple of thoughts/suggestions. First thing I would do is pull the rocker covers after running the motor for a few minutes ans see if oil is pulled in the corners of the lower rocker box. If flow is good, there should be pooled oil. Next, I would start the motor and watch/video oil flow at the rocker arms. It won's spray all over like a small block Chevy but will dribble through. The HD oiling system is based on flow/volume, not pressure. There should be an immediate and constant supply of oil between the push rod and rocker arm. If not, the oil supply to the top end is the issue and the solution is likely in the cam chest.
Apparently the noise did not present before upgrading the cam chest so it would seem that something in the upgrade is the source of the noise. Llike Mattbastard has inquired, which SE cam plate/pump was installed? The OP has not told us what oil pressure is, at idle and cruise which is pertinent. A video of the noise would help as well as knowing oil pressure.
I have never seen a push rod worn like the one on the left side of the OPs photo. Just a couple of thoughts/suggestions. First thing I would do is pull the rocker covers after running the motor for a few minutes ans see if oil is pulled in the corners of the lower rocker box. If flow is good, there should be pooled oil. Next, I would start the motor and watch/video oil flow at the rocker arms. It won's spray all over like a small block Chevy but will dribble through. The HD oiling system is based on flow/volume, not pressure. There should be an immediate and constant supply of oil between the push rod and rocker arm. If not, the oil supply to the top end is the issue and the solution is likely in the cam chest.
Apparently the noise did not present before upgrading the cam chest so it would seem that something in the upgrade is the source of the noise. Llike Mattbastard has inquired, which SE cam plate/pump was installed? The OP has not told us what oil pressure is, at idle and cruise which is pertinent. A video of the noise would help as well as knowing oil pressure.
As far as the o-ring, I ASSUME that he installed it properly (he is a certified Mech.)
I'll post a video for you to listen to.
HDF Community Team
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 12,776
Likes: 2,607
From: san antonio
The SE upgrade kit came with a high flow oil pump. That is what I had him put in. I do not have a pressure gage on the bike yet. I'll be getting on this week. As far as the o-ring, I ASSUME that he installed it properly (he is a certified Mech.) I'll post a video for you to listen to.
Thread Starter
|
Novice
Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 16
Likes: 1
From: Richfield Springs, NY
Grand HDF Member
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,843
Likes: 1,174
From: florida
did you look at the underside of the rocker arm where that weird worn pushrod came out of? maybe there is a matching/bad wear pattern on the rocker arm that is the issue? just a thought.
m
m
HDF Community Team
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 12,776
Likes: 2,607
From: san antonio
Definitely something amiss. I can hear regular valve train noise; not an issue but the other noise would concern me. I am assuming that this noise did not present prior to the cam chest upgrade? I don't like the motor movement at idle or the rhythm of the idle; just sounds off to me. My all bore 107" (124TQ/110HP) never moved around the much at idle. Could be that there is an oil pressure/volume issue that has gone on long enough (2000 miles) to cause internal damage. I suspect that there the metal from the worn push rods is traveling in the oil which could cause problems.
In addition to checking the rocker arm(s) per marcodarq's suggestion as well as pulling the rocker box covers to observe real time oil flow (which may show lifter failure as 2deuceguy suggests, I think I would also be checking compression and even a leak down test to confirm the condition of the top end as well as opening up the cam chest for a look see; particularly looking at the oil pump which could have been assembled wrong. I would also catch a little oil, hold it up to a light to see if you can detect any "sparkles" in the oil.
I would not be riding the bike until the problem is solved. I would not be in panic mode, could be a very simple solution. JMHO, but I would not be riding the bike until the problem was solved and would take every measure to find out the source and extent of the problem; there is a solution.
In addition to checking the rocker arm(s) per marcodarq's suggestion as well as pulling the rocker box covers to observe real time oil flow (which may show lifter failure as 2deuceguy suggests, I think I would also be checking compression and even a leak down test to confirm the condition of the top end as well as opening up the cam chest for a look see; particularly looking at the oil pump which could have been assembled wrong. I would also catch a little oil, hold it up to a light to see if you can detect any "sparkles" in the oil.
I would not be riding the bike until the problem is solved. I would not be in panic mode, could be a very simple solution. JMHO, but I would not be riding the bike until the problem was solved and would take every measure to find out the source and extent of the problem; there is a solution.
HD Forum Stories
The Best of Harley-Davidson for Lifelong Riders
7 Surprising Harley-Davidson Products that Are Not Motorcycles
Verdad Gallardo
8 Best Harley-Davidson Motorcycles Ever
Pouria Savadkouei
10 Worst Harley-Davidson Motorcycles Ever
Pouria Savadkouei
Killer Custom's Jail Break Is The Breakout That Refused to Blend In
Verdad Gallardo
Crazy Bunderbike Build Looks Amazing, But Is It Impossible to Ride?
Verdad Gallardo
Harley-Davidson Reveals Super Cool Cafe Racer Concept
Verdad Gallardo
Engraved Rebellion: Inside Bundnerbike's Glam Rock II
Verdad Gallardo
10 Motorcycles You Should Never Buy
Joe Kucinski
10 Things Harley-Davidson Needs to Fix in 2026
Verdad Gallardo
Thread Starter
|
Novice
Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 16
Likes: 1
From: Richfield Springs, NY
Definitely something amiss. I can hear regular valve train noise; not an issue but the other noise would concern me. I am assuming that this noise did not present prior to the cam chest upgrade? I don't like the motor movement at idle or the rhythm of the idle; just sounds off to me. My all bore 107" (124TQ/110HP) never moved around the much at idle. Could be that there is an oil pressure/volume issue that has gone on long enough (2000 miles) to cause internal damage. I suspect that there the metal from the worn push rods is traveling in the oil which could cause problems.
In addition to checking the rocker arm(s) per marcodarq's suggestion as well as pulling the rocker box covers to observe real time oil flow (which may show lifter failure as 2deuceguy suggests, I think I would also be checking compression and even a leak down test to confirm the condition of the top end as well as opening up the cam chest for a look see; particularly looking at the oil pump which could have been assembled wrong. I would also catch a little oil, hold it up to a light to see if you can detect any "sparkles" in the oil.
I would not be riding the bike until the problem is solved. I would not be in panic mode, could be a very simple solution. JMHO, but I would not be riding the bike until the problem was solved and would take every measure to find out the source and extent of the problem; there is a solution.
In addition to checking the rocker arm(s) per marcodarq's suggestion as well as pulling the rocker box covers to observe real time oil flow (which may show lifter failure as 2deuceguy suggests, I think I would also be checking compression and even a leak down test to confirm the condition of the top end as well as opening up the cam chest for a look see; particularly looking at the oil pump which could have been assembled wrong. I would also catch a little oil, hold it up to a light to see if you can detect any "sparkles" in the oil.
I would not be riding the bike until the problem is solved. I would not be in panic mode, could be a very simple solution. JMHO, but I would not be riding the bike until the problem was solved and would take every measure to find out the source and extent of the problem; there is a solution.
The noise started immediately after the cam plate upgrade and has not changed. I will look up at the bottom of the rocker arm when I take out the pushrods and open the cam chest. I will put a pressure gauge on it this week and likely try a Baisly spring to see if it makes any difference. Clearly an oil change is coming too.
It seems to me that oil is not getting to that exhaust lifter and my understanding is that is the last in line for oil. So, perhaps a sticky or leaky bypass valve?
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 4,315
Likes: 1,663
From: Tampa
Kinda wondering if maybe you didn't have a good oil prime in the new pump for a few miles and ended up doing some damage that's still somewhere in your system.
If you shut your bike off for a few minutes, then turn it back on, does your oil pressure light turn on?
If you shut your bike off for a few minutes, then turn it back on, does your oil pressure light turn on?