fuel problem EFI EVO
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Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 113
Likes: 0
From: Tenn
A little FYI about what I have been discovered today...
Fuel filter... $60
3 dealers and so far they all state that it needs to be ordered.
one of them, this kid tried to tell me that my bike didn't have a filter.. keep in mind I have held it my hand and also seen it in the parts book. I had to finally tell the kid to quit arguing with me and open up the damn book... Sheeez
I also learned from this guy that just so happened to walk up to the parts counter that the Temp sensor will NOT always cause a egine code. He also had the same bike as I do. I learned more from him in 5 mins of talking to him about the fuel system than talking to 4 different harley shops. Why didn't Harley know that the temp sensor doesn't always show a fault code... give up ? because most of these guys couldn't fix anything that isn't in a service book.
Temp sensor.. $95 ( I bought one of those too)
This guy (old school biker) I spoke with even went so far as to tell me in two minutes the easiest, quickest way to change this sensor.
im, thanks for your input with this ordeal.
One thing that was posted is incorrect and that is... there is a sensor that does control the fuel/air mix at idle. It is located on the side of the throttle body on the right side.
The other thing is that the temp sensor will not always produce a engine code. I suspect this would be if the sensor is only malfuntioning and has not completely gone out.
I will address the temp sensor when I get home in a couple weeks, luckly HD in Rapid City had one in stock that I bought, but it looks like I'm gonna have to order that fuel filter though.
Fuel filter... $60
3 dealers and so far they all state that it needs to be ordered.
one of them, this kid tried to tell me that my bike didn't have a filter.. keep in mind I have held it my hand and also seen it in the parts book. I had to finally tell the kid to quit arguing with me and open up the damn book... Sheeez
I also learned from this guy that just so happened to walk up to the parts counter that the Temp sensor will NOT always cause a egine code. He also had the same bike as I do. I learned more from him in 5 mins of talking to him about the fuel system than talking to 4 different harley shops. Why didn't Harley know that the temp sensor doesn't always show a fault code... give up ? because most of these guys couldn't fix anything that isn't in a service book.
Temp sensor.. $95 ( I bought one of those too)
This guy (old school biker) I spoke with even went so far as to tell me in two minutes the easiest, quickest way to change this sensor.
im, thanks for your input with this ordeal.
One thing that was posted is incorrect and that is... there is a sensor that does control the fuel/air mix at idle. It is located on the side of the throttle body on the right side.
The other thing is that the temp sensor will not always produce a engine code. I suspect this would be if the sensor is only malfuntioning and has not completely gone out.
I will address the temp sensor when I get home in a couple weeks, luckly HD in Rapid City had one in stock that I bought, but it looks like I'm gonna have to order that fuel filter though.
Road Warrior
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,952
Likes: 15
From: Senoia, Ga., by way of Miami, Fl..
Just a little info for anyone interested, regarding codes.. They will NOT always be set with a failure. Thats one of the misconceptions we've been fighting in the automotive biz for decades.. The only way the module can "see" a fault is for there to be an electrical fault that takes the value out of its normal range. If it fails in range (usually biased), the module assumes its a valid reading and acts accordingly. Typically, the code is due to an open or short, though high resistance or slow responce can trigger a code too. Be carefull with giving the "dumb box" too much credit. Its a great tool, but its not much different than a little guy with a volt meter watching signals and flipping switches based on those readings.. Sometimes, he's drunk...
Good luck, hope your on to something.. Mine turned out to be the ignition pick-up wire..
Good luck, hope your on to something.. Mine turned out to be the ignition pick-up wire..
Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 113
Likes: 0
From: Tenn
FIXED (I think)
Got home today and went straight to the bike, installed the filter and replaced the Temp sensor.
I went on a nice ride with NO problems..
The bike even felt like it gained another 10-20 hp even. I say the filter was a major issue.
Maybe now I can get some riding in this week
I went on a nice ride with NO problems..
The bike even felt like it gained another 10-20 hp even. I say the filter was a major issue.
Maybe now I can get some riding in this week
Advanced
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 72
Likes: 3
From: Overland Park, KS
Thanks for creating this thread with lots of good info for future reference. And thanks for taking the pics of the gas. It's amazing that the gas could be that nasty after so many tank drainings.
Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 113
Likes: 0
From: Tenn
The gas pictures was not from the gas tank but rather what dumped out from the fuel filter itself.
FYI....
I used your basic hose clamp to reconnect the filter but used the factory clamp for the cross over lines since it was in plain sight. Instead of buying HD tool to tighten/ crimp the factory clamp... I used a pair of tile nippers that is used to chip ceramic tile. I don't know what HD charges for their special crimpers, but the tile tool works the same way and I'm sure its a hell of a lot cheaper and does apply even pressure to both sides of the clamp (unlike wire cutters that apply pressure from back to front)
2nd Gear
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Check-Valve tube
I had a similar issue on my '02 Fatboy, engine revs on it's own but under power it would spit puke and sputter.... Mine turned out to be two pin-hole leaks in the tube running from the checkvalve on the ouside of the tank to the fuel pump inside the tank. This happened on my way home from Sturgis in 2004 and again 3 years later. Basically you lose pressure when the fuel level in the tank gets below these pinholes.
No need to remove the tank
CAREFULLY - Drain the gas out at the crossover hose at the front of the tank. ( you may need a second set of hands to hold the container you're draining into)
Remove the dashboard
open up the top panel to access the tank internals (about 16 screws)
You have to carefully release the fule pump bracket to release the fule pump. (This can be ornery - took me about 15 minutes to finally get it released)
Detach the check valve hose from the fuel pump
unscrew the check valve from the outside of the tank
install the new checkvalve with hose pre-attached.
Attach the hose to the fuel pump with supplied crimp clamps
Resecure the fuel pump
and button her back up......
I changed my fuel filter while I was at it, might want to do that while you're in there.
No need to remove the tank
CAREFULLY - Drain the gas out at the crossover hose at the front of the tank. ( you may need a second set of hands to hold the container you're draining into)
Remove the dashboard
open up the top panel to access the tank internals (about 16 screws)
You have to carefully release the fule pump bracket to release the fule pump. (This can be ornery - took me about 15 minutes to finally get it released)
Detach the check valve hose from the fuel pump
unscrew the check valve from the outside of the tank
install the new checkvalve with hose pre-attached.
Attach the hose to the fuel pump with supplied crimp clamps
Resecure the fuel pump
and button her back up......
I changed my fuel filter while I was at it, might want to do that while you're in there.
Intermediate
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 49
Likes: 1
From: Iowa
Had to relace the temp sensor on my RK w/FI, it never left a code just wouldn't idle down. Been there done that with the fuel filter. Replaced the fuel lines while I was there did not even want to have to go back in there unless at gun point (got big fat hands
)
)
6th Gear
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 14
Likes: 0
From: Wisconsin
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Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 5,080
Likes: 2,157
From: Ohio
Correct on the MM system not throwing a code for the temp sensor and can throw you off track, the air temp sensor on the throttle body will cause an inconsistant idle and will usually die, the Harley oil misting system covers it with oil and just needs cleaned for repair.
The MM system has a port on the bottom of the steel fuel tank connection line and can be measured with a pressure gauge, appreciate the indepth post from the member above but the MM system doesn't have the dreaded plastic hose failure as the Delphi system, it has internal steel lines joined by fuel grade rubber hoses and rule number one is don't always assume the problem is a computer controlled failure because it has on on it, even the seasoned techs still make this mistake.
Good to see the Evo members learning from each other and not afraid to be open minded and do what we do best "fix it ourselves"
The MM system has a port on the bottom of the steel fuel tank connection line and can be measured with a pressure gauge, appreciate the indepth post from the member above but the MM system doesn't have the dreaded plastic hose failure as the Delphi system, it has internal steel lines joined by fuel grade rubber hoses and rule number one is don't always assume the problem is a computer controlled failure because it has on on it, even the seasoned techs still make this mistake.
Good to see the Evo members learning from each other and not afraid to be open minded and do what we do best "fix it ourselves"
Road Captain
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 734
Likes: 0
From: Southern Missouri ( ozarks)
YO! hang around.....check the dates of these posts! (they're "several" years old! Ha! I've done the same thing!!
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