recommendations for engine work
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Stage II
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
recommendations for engine work
I have a 02 duece (efi). I'm curious as to where to start for work on the engine. I want to get all the work done at once, i already have v&h big radius pipes, and a screaming eagle heavy breather intake. I would like to jump up to a 95" from my 88". But is the stage II kit really worth it?
Elite HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 4,722
Likes: 5
From: Biddeford, Maine
Depends on how far you want to go. Big bore is worth it for sure, either 95" or 98" would be what you want. Head work will make a huge difference and also set the compression ration for the cams that you choose. Doing it all at once is the way to go, that way you just have to get one dyno tune done and you'll be good to go.
Steve
Steve
Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 168
Likes: 1
From: Irmo, SC
I have an '06 EFI Deuce. I went from 88" to 95" w/ SE203 cams, SE Cast High Compression pistons, heads cleaned up by me, and tuned it myself w/ SEST and my own "stuff". The only thing I would have done differently is added compression releases. A lot of people talk smack about SE parts (in particular the SE203 cams), but when it comes down to it there is really nothing wrong with them. You need to figure out what you want out of your bike. When it comes to SE cams, I like to think of their performance in this way: SE255 cams= light to light; SE203/SE204 cams= 1/8th mile to 1/4 mile; and SE211/SE251 cams= 1/4 mile on up for performance purposes. You could also apply the same thinking to Andrews cams TW21, TW26/TW37, and TW44. IMO you wont get the same idle lope out of a set of cams with EFI like a carb bike. And finally, to answer your question "is the "Stage 2" kit really worth it?" - my "home brew Stage 2" was well worth $1200 (that includes the price of the SEST) I have into it. You are going the right direction by doing everything at once. Hope this helps. Later, Calvin.
Road Captain
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 581
Likes: 7
From: Portland, OR
Is it the use of the SE Cast High Compression pistons why you say that you would have added compression releases? I wouldnt think just the 95 kit and 203 cams would require compression releases. Is your bike a little hard to turn over now?
Cruiser
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 104
Likes: 0
From: Springfield, MO
Get a good shop to do the work and have them flow bench everything. An off the shelf kit will never compete with a true speed shop (like it or not!). Find a competent shop and tell them what you want...
I disagree with dyno runs too. They get close, but nothing like on the street. No weight, no wind, no hills, etc... Real time air fuel ratio knowledge beats any money spent on dyno runs.
I disagree with dyno runs too. They get close, but nothing like on the street. No weight, no wind, no hills, etc... Real time air fuel ratio knowledge beats any money spent on dyno runs.
Last edited by kstewart422; Jul 8, 2009 at 04:14 PM.
Sponsor
Joined: Dec 2007
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Many options available, but one combination that folks love, is a Wood 6 combined with boring your cylinders to 98" and a good* set of cylinder heads. Great fuel economy, smooth running, and fantastic power from near off-idle to 5500 plus.
Scott
Scott
Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 168
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From: Irmo, SC
Yes and yes to the two questions. The regular flat tops would not need compression releases. (IMO) The most important parts to any build are proper component matching (ie cams to compression ratio and cams to rpm range), assembly, break in, and tuning. You read about putting a bunch of "stuff" together, letting it idle for a long time upon first start, and not tunning it; then they rebuild it later with proper matched components, treat it right from the get go, and get it tuned. Then they say all of the components from the first build aren't worth a hoot and every component from the second build is the ****, when in all actuallality the first build would have been okay if they followed the "important parts" first. My build might not have came from a speed shop, but I am not afraid to take on a speed shop build either. The speed shop build might just be surprised by Deuce"Zilla".LoL! Later, Calvin.
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Road Warrior
Joined: Dec 2007
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my heads were off the shelf Baisley pro streets
my cylinders and pistons were off the eshelf from axtell
my T/B was off the shelf from HP inc
my Crank was from S&S and totally re-worked from Hoban.
its the Combo of Parts from A REPUTABLE company such as Baisley , Hillside... or
then have a world class engine Builder and Tuner such as Dave from JD's cycleworks put it together and thats the real world diffrence.
As far as the Dyno comment From KSTEWART
"disagree with dyno runs too. They get close, but nothing like on the street. No weight, no wind, no hills, etc... Real time air fuel ratio knowledge beats any money spent on dyno runs."
This statement is not totally true back in the day a good tuner could dial a bike in to approx 80-85% but with the dyno and a compenent tuner your lookingg at more like 90-98% .
afr has a lot to do with it but afr is only a small piece to the puzzle. some bikes run great being a little rich and some run great being a little lean. with th edyno you can zero in on what works best for each motor.
no amount of street tuning can ever compare to a dyno.
Strap the bike on a dyno and tune it properly with a tuning device such as a TTS or SERT and 60 dyno runs later (some more some less depending on the base map and combo of parts) varyingr RPM and load the bike will be tuned.
it all depends on the operator of the dyno and the combo of parts he is tuning.
no amount of dyno or street tuning can ever make a combo of bad parts run good.
I have over 350 dyno pulls on my motor. it was used as a test bike and boy was it tested.
350 dyno pulls,,,, many many high rpm runs (7000rpm red line) with guys i ride with (they ride crotch rockets 600 cc yamaha r6) also some long distance rides 500-600 mile days and this motor never misses a beat and impresses the Hell out of them guys..
my cylinders and pistons were off the eshelf from axtell
my T/B was off the shelf from HP inc
my Crank was from S&S and totally re-worked from Hoban.
its the Combo of Parts from A REPUTABLE company such as Baisley , Hillside... or
then have a world class engine Builder and Tuner such as Dave from JD's cycleworks put it together and thats the real world diffrence.
As far as the Dyno comment From KSTEWART
"disagree with dyno runs too. They get close, but nothing like on the street. No weight, no wind, no hills, etc... Real time air fuel ratio knowledge beats any money spent on dyno runs."
This statement is not totally true back in the day a good tuner could dial a bike in to approx 80-85% but with the dyno and a compenent tuner your lookingg at more like 90-98% .
afr has a lot to do with it but afr is only a small piece to the puzzle. some bikes run great being a little rich and some run great being a little lean. with th edyno you can zero in on what works best for each motor.
no amount of street tuning can ever compare to a dyno.
Strap the bike on a dyno and tune it properly with a tuning device such as a TTS or SERT and 60 dyno runs later (some more some less depending on the base map and combo of parts) varyingr RPM and load the bike will be tuned.
it all depends on the operator of the dyno and the combo of parts he is tuning.
no amount of dyno or street tuning can ever make a combo of bad parts run good.
I have over 350 dyno pulls on my motor. it was used as a test bike and boy was it tested.
350 dyno pulls,,,, many many high rpm runs (7000rpm red line) with guys i ride with (they ride crotch rockets 600 cc yamaha r6) also some long distance rides 500-600 mile days and this motor never misses a beat and impresses the Hell out of them guys..
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