spark plug
Road Warrior
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,923
Likes: 587
From: Alorton, Illinois
I have been using NGK replacement plugs exclusively at my shop for over 10 years. 7's mostly and high compression. I use the 8's. There are two different NGK plugs out there. Solid tips or screw on's. I use the solids.
I have never had an issue with ION sensing because of these plugs. I average 2-3 tunes a week. Most problems I identify are caused by plug wires. Usually with the end that goes to spark plug.
I have never had an issue with ION sensing because of these plugs. I average 2-3 tunes a week. Most problems I identify are caused by plug wires. Usually with the end that goes to spark plug.
Thread Starter
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Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 2,296
Likes: 494
From: WI
I have been using NGK replacement plugs exclusively at my shop for over 10 years. 7's mostly and high compression. I use the 8's. There are two different NGK plugs out there. Solid tips or screw on's. I use the solids.
I have never had an issue with ION sensing because of these plugs. I average 2-3 tunes a week. Most problems I identify are caused by plug wires. Usually with the end that goes to spark plug.
I have never had an issue with ION sensing because of these plugs. I average 2-3 tunes a week. Most problems I identify are caused by plug wires. Usually with the end that goes to spark plug.
Grand HDF Member
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,843
Likes: 1,174
From: florida
Just for the record, I am the forum member that Ed was referring to having the knock issues in Forida. Both NGK Dcpr8e and Dcpr7e. Removed NGK plugs and installed stock, then the ecm stopped pulling timing due to knock events.
What Ed is posting is in fact the truth. Believe what you want, but Ed was also one of the best teachers i ever had at the MOCO, and is a huge help to many of us here.
marco
What Ed is posting is in fact the truth. Believe what you want, but Ed was also one of the best teachers i ever had at the MOCO, and is a huge help to many of us here.
marco
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 4,359
Likes: 1,219
From: Dubuque, IA
Just for the record, I am the forum member that Ed was referring to having the knock issues in Forida. Both NGK Dcpr8e and Dcpr7e. Removed NGK plugs and installed stock, then the ecm stopped pulling timing due to knock events.
What Ed is posting is in fact the truth. Believe what you want, but Ed was also one of the best teachers i ever had at the MOCO, and is a huge help to many of us here.
marco
What Ed is posting is in fact the truth. Believe what you want, but Ed was also one of the best teachers i ever had at the MOCO, and is a huge help to many of us here.
marco
But run those Champions if you want. I'm not here to change your mind, just to debunk the false info being spread for those that may be confused by it.
I'm pretty sure if Harley was putting out motors that only ran properly using the champions, they would have to supply them for free.
I also run these plug wires because of the positive engagement they have on the plugs. There's no mistaking when they snap on the plugs and they fit tight.
Last edited by 60Gunner; Oct 17, 2020 at 07:38 AM.
Grand HDF Member
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 3,843
Likes: 1,174
From: florida
ok Gunner, here we go...............................
85% of what you have to say is bullsh@@ and most of it will get a beginner person either hurt or separated from more cash than necessary. you believe what you want.
My posts are based in facts. period. not conversations, not opinions, and not pipe dreams. you would be much better served by listening to the people that have PROVEN experience with a given topic. just because you talked to an engineer, doesnt mean he was a good one or had relevant experience. I'm not some young kid behind a keyboard, you are more than welcome to come by and we can discuss it like grownups if you''d like. Just remember, some people read these boards and don't know who really knows their stuff and who doesn't, so if it sounds good to their mind, they will try it. With a motorcycle, that can be DEADLY, COSTLY and could still get someone hurt. I am asking that you keep these ideas in mind when you post.
i run NGK's in lots of stuff and love them. i will still run them in bikes that do nt have the ION sense in the equation.
That being said, why don't you post up about your own EXPERIENCE with testing these points, not your opinions.
marco
85% of what you have to say is bullsh@@ and most of it will get a beginner person either hurt or separated from more cash than necessary. you believe what you want.
My posts are based in facts. period. not conversations, not opinions, and not pipe dreams. you would be much better served by listening to the people that have PROVEN experience with a given topic. just because you talked to an engineer, doesnt mean he was a good one or had relevant experience. I'm not some young kid behind a keyboard, you are more than welcome to come by and we can discuss it like grownups if you''d like. Just remember, some people read these boards and don't know who really knows their stuff and who doesn't, so if it sounds good to their mind, they will try it. With a motorcycle, that can be DEADLY, COSTLY and could still get someone hurt. I am asking that you keep these ideas in mind when you post.
i run NGK's in lots of stuff and love them. i will still run them in bikes that do nt have the ION sense in the equation.
That being said, why don't you post up about your own EXPERIENCE with testing these points, not your opinions.
marco
ok Gunner, here we go...............................
85% of what you have to say is bullsh@@ and most of it will get a beginner person either hurt or separated from more cash than necessary. you believe what you want.
My posts are based in facts. period. not conversations, not opinions, and not pipe dreams. you would be much better served by listening to the people that have PROVEN experience with a given topic. just because you talked to an engineer, doesnt mean he was a good one or had relevant experience. I'm not some young kid behind a keyboard, you are more than welcome to come by and we can discuss it like grownups if you''d like. Just remember, some people read these boards and don't know who really knows their stuff and who doesn't, so if it sounds good to their mind, they will try it. With a motorcycle, that can be DEADLY, COSTLY and could still get someone hurt. I am asking that you keep these ideas in mind when you post.
i run NGK's in lots of stuff and love them. i will still run them in bikes that do nt have the ION sense in the equation.
That being said, why don't you post up about your own EXPERIENCE with testing these points, not your opinions.
marco
85% of what you have to say is bullsh@@ and most of it will get a beginner person either hurt or separated from more cash than necessary. you believe what you want.
My posts are based in facts. period. not conversations, not opinions, and not pipe dreams. you would be much better served by listening to the people that have PROVEN experience with a given topic. just because you talked to an engineer, doesnt mean he was a good one or had relevant experience. I'm not some young kid behind a keyboard, you are more than welcome to come by and we can discuss it like grownups if you''d like. Just remember, some people read these boards and don't know who really knows their stuff and who doesn't, so if it sounds good to their mind, they will try it. With a motorcycle, that can be DEADLY, COSTLY and could still get someone hurt. I am asking that you keep these ideas in mind when you post.
i run NGK's in lots of stuff and love them. i will still run them in bikes that do nt have the ION sense in the equation.
That being said, why don't you post up about your own EXPERIENCE with testing these points, not your opinions.
marco
1) The reference from a Delphi engineer was a copy and paste - he didn't have a discussion. He's just taking something he found posted to a Sportster forum and reposting it not understanding what actually happens behind the scenes with calibrations.
2) Delphi sells the ECMs with a base ION sense setting, the OEM engineers then adjust it to what they want it to be. ION sense actually monitors for misfire and knock. And the incorrect plug or wire can actually cause issues with either. I have the calibration documents on this, but certainly aren't going to post them in HD Forums to refute this silliness. However, for all the technicians who actually have been around HDs for a while, they will remember the run of false no combustion codes in the mid 2000's. That was actually the ION sense adjustability that was set incorrectly. Adjusting the sensitivity in the calibration fixed that. We literally had no-combustion codes popping in 100% bone stock bikes.
3) As stated previously, some plugs will work, some won't. Also as posted in this and another thread, the advice that people can use any plug and it doesn't affect ION sense is irresponsible as well as ill informed. It shows how uninformed and inexperienced the poster actually is. When Delphi first launched, Screamin' Eagle had to rework their spark plug wires, and also we had issues with some SE platinum plugs.
Last edited by Ed Ramberger; Oct 17, 2020 at 04:47 PM.
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2017
Posts: 4,359
Likes: 1,219
From: Dubuque, IA
Well I guess all of us running NGKs are just beginners that don't have a clue then. Better run out and get some champions.
But I'm glad you told me they rework that ion sense to only work with champion plugs. If I ever do have an issue, I'll know where the blame lies and where to go to have it "fixed" buy reworking my ECM to work properly with my choice of plugs.
But I'm glad you told me they rework that ion sense to only work with champion plugs. If I ever do have an issue, I'll know where the blame lies and where to go to have it "fixed" buy reworking my ECM to work properly with my choice of plugs.
Last edited by 60Gunner; Oct 17, 2020 at 07:13 PM.
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