I have a 98 ultra with a stage 2 kit. It has the infamous Magneti Marelli FI system on it. I have been having a hard time keeping the hot and cold idle's set and it is hard to start cold, pops through the pipes when letting off the throttle and occasionally stumbles for a brief second on the highway.. My mechanic suggested switching over to an S&S carb and new ignition system (Approx $2100.00). Anybody done this yet and how did it work out?

 

Just take it to someone that knows how to tune it. Apparently your Indy doesn't. Once it's tuned properly you shouldn't have any isues. Alot cheaper than 2100 bucks

 

Agree. I run the MM injection on my 01 and runs like a top. I have to clean the airbleeds out every 2 or three months, but thats been the only problem. Bike had 4000 miles on it when i bought it in 07 and 50000 on it now.

 

What the two previous posters said. Only a few people know how to service the M/M.

Mine is a 2000 with 95", TW21 cam, Gerolomy bored throttle body, ported and milled heads, 2 into 1 exhaust.

Start by cleaning the throttle body with carb cleaner or brake cleaner. Clean the two holes at the top of each throat until clear cleaner comes out. Before you adjust the cold and hot idle try pulling the two fuses under the right side cover and let the ecm reset. Without starting the engine switch on the ignition for about 10 seconds then shut it off. Do this twice to let it learn the new position.

If that doesn't improve the idle, then you will have to adjust the two screws that control
the hot and cold idle. Then pull the fuses for about 15 min. Once again on and off to learn new settings. If the memory isn't cleared and reset the system will go back to the setting before you adjusted any thing.

 

The M & M system is a reliable system and is used in some very expensive vehicles.
The problem is very few techs. are educated on the system.
The system used on Harley is rather simple and workable but few techs. want to read the service manual since most HD bikes are Delphi injection (for over 12 years). Consider reading the section on fuel injection in the service manual as it may allow you to save some significant money.
Lets see if more information is available:
1- 98 ultra with stage 2
2-miles ?
3-how long have you owned it?
4-Have you looked in the tank for debri, the painted liner at bottom center located inside of tank sometimes gets loose and clogs fuel suction...Free to check,relatively easy and requires a screw driver, 1 wrench, 1 torx bit and about 30 minutes.
5-Have you looked at the cam position sensor by your right foot floorboard "the v2 cone" look at hole at bottom of cone were wire exits for melted goo..when you see the goo the sensor is dieing, hard start and check engine light with code #56..you get alot of cranking but nothing and then finally a short crank starts bike, no tools required for quick check, free, easy, no tools(maybe a flashlight). about 2 minutes.
6-you did read/check for engine codes?? free, easy and no tools. about 5 minutes
7-did you check the hidden crank position sensor CONNECTOR..very hidden..behind right plastic cover (cover under the seat on right side)..just behind the frame tube,right behind the triangle of the motorcycle frame..IT IS AN INSERT and TWIST AND LOCK BLACK CONNECTOR..it gets loose and motor WILL stumble when you hit the right bump, tar strip or road irregularity. If you have trouble finding it then start at oil filter. sensor is right next to oil filter on left side of bike and wire then runs along left side of bike then crosses between motor and transmission to right side and then disappears behind the plastic cover. Once you locate it make sure to use disconnect, check, reconnect and use several zip ties to make sure it does not it does not disconnect ever again.
8-How are the two fuel lines ? leak, no leak? they leak at swivel after about 8-10 years, also decompose from inside out and originals are not serviceable for the most part..goodridge (hdfL005) makes replacements at less than a third of HD cost .checking is easy, takes no tool and about 2 minutes (you can smell the fuel and see drops on primary).
9-engine temp. sensor: erratic running, cold idle bad..there are some service checks but i do not have them memorized.Bike gets confused not knowing if it is hot or cold. It is relatively easy to change and requires a few hand tools. located in front chimney.
10-engine idle control, sometimes gets stuck especially in high salt area's.
11-When everything else fails check the ECM connectors. Box and Wire connector. The ground pins get corrosion if someone has been soaking the bike with high pressure, failed to re-install the rubber boot during a power commander installation, damaged the boot or is in a high salt area. Takes about 30 minutes with normal hand tools and clean with electrical connector spray(about $6).
* I hate spending money and i imagine the above have been checked.

If you still decide to go the carb. route consider a quick search on the forum as a few members have completed a successful conversion.

 

Good info im.

 

[quote=im;10811656]The M & M system is a reliable system and is used in some very expensive vehicles.
The problem is very few techs. are educated on the system.
The system used on Harley is rather simple and workable but few techs. want to read the service manual since most HD bikes are Delphi injection (for over 12 years). Consider reading the section on fuel injection in the service manual as it may allow you to save some significant money.
Lets see if more information is available:
1- 98 ultra with stage 2
2-miles ?
3-how long have you owned it?
4-Have you looked in the tank for debri, the painted liner at bottom center located inside of tank sometimes gets loose and clogs fuel suction...Free to check,relatively easy and requires a screw driver, 1 wrench, 1 torx bit and about 30 minutes.
5-Have you looked at the cam position sensor by your right foot floorboard "the v2 cone" look at hole at bottom of cone were wire exits for melted goo..when you see the goo the sensor is dieing, hard start and check engine light with code #56..you get alot of cranking but nothing and then finally a short crank starts bike, no tools required for quick check, free, easy, no tools(maybe a flashlight). about 2 minutes.
6-you did read/check for engine codes?? free, easy and no tools. about 5 minutes
7-did you check the hidden crank position sensor CONNECTOR..very hidden..behind right plastic cover (cover under the seat on right side)..just behind the frame tube,right behind the triangle of the motorcycle frame..IT IS AN INSERT and TWIST AND LOCK BLACK CONNECTOR..it gets loose and motor WILL stumble when you hit the right bump, tar strip or road irregularity. If you have trouble finding it then start at oil filter. sensor is right next to oil filter on left side of bike and wire then runs along left side of bike then crosses between motor and transmission to right side and then disappears behind the plastic cover. Once you locate it make sure to use disconnect, check, reconnect and use several zip ties to make sure it does not it does not disconnect ever again.
8-How are the two fuel lines ? leak, no leak? they leak at swivel after about 8-10 years, also decompose from inside out and originals are not serviceable for the most part..goodridge (hdfL005) makes replacements at less than a third of HD cost .checking is easy, takes no tool and about 2 minutes (you can smell the fuel and see drops on primary).
9-engine temp. sensor: erratic running, cold idle bad..there are some service checks but i do not have them memorized.Bike gets confused not knowing if it is hot or cold. It is relatively easy to change and requires a few hand tools. located in front chimney.
10-engine idle control, sometimes gets stuck especially in high salt area's.
11-When everything else fails check the ECM connectors. Box and Wire connector. The ground pins get corrosion if someone has been soaking the bike with high pressure, failed to re-install the rubber boot during a power commander installation, damaged the boot or is in a high salt area. Takes about 30 minutes with normal hand tools and clean with electrical connector spray(about $6).

I have just turned 61,000 and have owned it apptox 3 years. Had 26,000 when I got it.
I have not checked inside the tank, but I will.
Had the cam position sensor changed at local dealer. (it was melting)
It isn't showing any codes, also had dealer check ECM and they said it was good.
I will check the crank position sensor ASAP.
I will change the fuel lines this weekend and reset the ECM as you advised.
Thank you for you're advice as I really don't want to go carbed. If you know some one in the Houston, tx area that is good with the MM I would appreciate the reference. Is it someting I could learn to do myself? (with the right equipment)

 

[QUOTE=Green Monster98;10812085]1-No special equipment and cheap simple hand tools required for the above.
Most difficult tool might be the torx bit for the gas tank bolts ( i think it is a t27 ) and LOWES sells that for less than $5. Ace probably has it too. There is a gasket but it is re-usable most times and the screws are location specific with little clear plastic collars.
2- The inside of gas tank(loose liner) would cause you to have a loss of fuel/starve and then when you get off the throttle and suction stops the bike would be OK again and cycle would repeat. Does not sound like what you describe but check it.
3-The cam sensor would be a starting thing like i mentioned..the goo is the secret along with a code (check engine light on)..
4- The fuel lines are a visible leak/smell thing and idle could be affected.
5- You can learn a lot with the service manual (part number 99483-98) by reading chapter number 9 (fuel injection) . Try NEW CASTLE Harley Davidson for about $60 delivered. For better pictures of parts the parts catalog is good but you can go online to Ronnies harley davidson and see the part drawing online.
If everything checks out then look at the engine temp. sensor but do NOT buy any parts until they are confirmed bad. The temp. sensor does not give a code sometimes and makes bike run really bad with surging and dieing at the same time...please check the connector i mentioned as that is a SOB that will drive you crazy until you find it.

 

Ok ,Thanks. What I was wondering about was the equipment to set hot/cold idle and does the ECM need to be programed for fuel to air mixture with the stage 2 kit? Thinking about learning to do all this myself.

 

No equipment,
Consider purchase of service manual since the chapter on fuel injection alone has about 100 easy to read pages.
Setting of hot/cold idle when the throttle body is dirty or if the engine temp. sensor is failing would be a waste of time.
If the bike came with a stage II kit and it was done correctly(dealer) then a cam, pipes, aircleaner and a download was performed or someone took it to a dyno and used some kind of tuner. If something else was done and you are unaware then it will require for you to investigate at some point.
No major equipment to set hot and cold idle. If for some reason you need to due a major change to the air / fuel mixture beyond idle adjustment then a dyno tune would be suggested.
If bike was running OK before there is a high probability the problems are a combination of those documented for you before.
Adjusting things before identification of problem could place you running in circles.