4th gear slippage
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 98
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From: Tallahassee, Florida
Ya know, I can relate to riding the bike for the rest of the Summer, but it could let you down completely if the friction **** eventually tears off the disks. One thing to consider, perhaps, is the clutch is very easy to remove, and once the clutch is removed, the transmission is almost ready to take out -- you got four bolts on the primary side, and of course, you gotta take the final drive chain and sprocket off the timing side. The only special too you really need is the clutch spring compressor during reassembly. I think some careful use of a dremel tool could cure your jumping out of gear problem.
Don't know your precise circumstances, but it would be hard to find any transmission simpler than a four speed sportster.
Maybe ya oughta consider going for it . . . ?
Last edited by halmc; Jun 28, 2009 at 05:01 PM.
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 98
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From: Tallahassee, Florida
Excellent! I have one of those harmonic dampner pullers (pushers) in my tool drawer.
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Joined: Jun 2009
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well i got the tranny out and i can'nt see anything wrong there,everything looks brand new and works perfectly manually in my hand!no signs of chipping or dragging,nothing...so i'm assuming the clutch discs,allthough they look good also,what i'll do is take them both to the local around the way mechanic where i get parts and see if he will give some input..all in all it was'nt bad of a disassembly,we'll see how it all gos back together thou
i'd of been lost without the factory manual.....thats a cool tool mick
i'd of been lost without the factory manual.....thats a cool tool mick
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Joined: Jun 2009
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That's my experience too, irrespective of whether we talkin' motorcycles, cars, or trucks. My intuitive physics and shoddy physics training doesn't provide the answer as to why clutchs begin to slip in higher gears.
Ya know, I can relate to riding the bike for the rest of the Summer, but it could let you down completely if the friction **** eventually tears off the disks. One thing to consider, perhaps, is the clutch is very easy to remove, and once the clutch is removed, the transmission is almost ready to take out -- you got four bolts on the primary side, and of course, you gotta take the final drive chain and sprocket off the timing side. The only special too you really need is the clutch spring compressor during reassembly. I think some careful use of a dremel tool could cure your jumping out of gear problem.
Don't know your precise circumstances, but it would be hard to find any transmission simpler than a four speed sportster.
Maybe ya oughta consider going for it . . . ?
Ya know, I can relate to riding the bike for the rest of the Summer, but it could let you down completely if the friction **** eventually tears off the disks. One thing to consider, perhaps, is the clutch is very easy to remove, and once the clutch is removed, the transmission is almost ready to take out -- you got four bolts on the primary side, and of course, you gotta take the final drive chain and sprocket off the timing side. The only special too you really need is the clutch spring compressor during reassembly. I think some careful use of a dremel tool could cure your jumping out of gear problem.
Don't know your precise circumstances, but it would be hard to find any transmission simpler than a four speed sportster.
Maybe ya oughta consider going for it . . . ?
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,035
Likes: 17
From: Houston Texas
just outa curiosity, what are your ideas with the dremel?
DO NOT EVEN CONSIDER USING A DREMEL ON ANYTHING IN THE TRANSMISSION!
If you are wondering if I am serious when I say that, be assured that yes, I am very serious......... pg
DO NOT EVEN CONSIDER USING A DREMEL ON ANYTHING IN THE TRANSMISSION!
If you are wondering if I am serious when I say that, be assured that yes, I am very serious......... pg
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 98
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From: Tallahassee, Florida
The dogs on the sliding gears can get and are likely rounded off and there is some chance -- particularly if you're on a tight budget -- that you can dress them a bit -- maybe enough -- with a dremel. Incdentally, you won't find anything wrong with the constant mesh gears themselves that would cause the transmission to jump out of gear. The trouble will almost certainly be either worn dogs or bearings and bushings that are so badly trashed that proper alignment of the moving parts is the issue. Similarly, insofar as the shift mechanism is concerned, the same forces that hold the transmission in 1, 2 and 3rd gears hold it in fourth. I would carefully examine the dogs on the sliding gear and dress them on the chance that it might work. The downside is that you might make it jump out worse.
Let me say as gently as I can: Bullshit. If you're too timid to use a dremel where it is called for than you shouldn't be dissing' others' advice. You might give more than passing thought to the fact that his transmission doesn't work now: inspecting the dogs and perhaps shaping them a bit ain't gonna make it worse. It is good to know, however, that you're serious. I have a T-56 six speed transmission in my Mazda RX 7 -- the one I put a Chevy LT-1 in -- that required the dremel treatment and I'll invite you to watch the video to see if I got it right.
Last edited by halmc; Jun 30, 2009 at 06:21 AM.
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Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,035
Likes: 17
From: Houston Texas
The dogs on the sliding gears can get and are likely rounded off and there is some chance -- particularly if you're on a tight budget -- that you can dress them a bit -- maybe enough -- with a dremel. Incdentally, you won't find anything wrong with the constant mesh gears themselves that would cause the transmission to jump out of gear. The trouble will almost certainly be either worn dogs or bearings and bushings that are so badly trashed that proper alignment of the moving parts is the issue. Similarly, insofar as the shift mechanism is concerned, the same forces that hold the transmission in 1, 2 and 3rd gears hold it in fourth. I would carefully examine the dogs on the sliding gear and dress them on the chance that it might work. The downside is that you might make it jump out worse.
Let me say as gently as I can: Bullshit. If you're too timid to use a dremel where it is called for than you shouldn't be dissing' others' advice. You might give more than passing thought to the fact that his transmission doesn't work now: inspecting the dogs and perhaps shaping them a bit ain't gonna make it worse. It is good to know, however, that you're serious.
Let me say as gently as I can: Bullshit. If you're too timid to use a dremel where it is called for than you shouldn't be dissing' others' advice. You might give more than passing thought to the fact that his transmission doesn't work now: inspecting the dogs and perhaps shaping them a bit ain't gonna make it worse. It is good to know, however, that you're serious.
Over time, with use (and abuse) the dogs and edges of the gears wear.
To tell someone take you can take a Dremel tool and fix this is simply wrong and misleading. A dog that has rounded off the corners cannot be made whole again with a Dremal tool. Ha-Ha, even the thought of that makes me laugh!
In fact, I will borrow your description and say that this is also pure Bullshit on your part to even suggest such a thing. It does show how little you know about transmissions though. So thanks for that one.
To say the Sportster 4 speed transmission is simple is also wrong.
It has to be assembled and shimmed correctly or it is not going to work.
How many of you out there in this forum have used a Dremel tool successfully to repair your transmission that was jumping out of gear? I am waiting to hear all about it..........
Ping...Ping....Ping
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Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 98
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From: Tallahassee, Florida
Several difficulties: there are uncaged roller bearings on the output shaft. I have found it easier to remove the circlip that is behind the output shaft seal and insert the rollers from the RH side of the case after the transmission is in place. You can assemble the rollers first, pack 'em in with grease, but I think coming in after the trans is in place is easier. There are 23 of 'em.
Second: Don't recall whether your bike is RH or LH shift. In both cases you've got to ensure that the shifter 'ball' is exactly where it belongs. In the case of a LH shifter, the shaft goes through the trap door, so it's quite a bit easier. you cam insert the transmission with one hand and hold the shifter in place throughout the insertion process. With the RH shifter it's a bit more tricky, but suffice it to say that you have to arrange the shifter so that the arm is sticking out horizontally. I mark the end of the splined shaft with a line parallel to the shifter arm.
There is risk that the shifter rotates a bit and winds up pointing at the bottom of the case. It won't shift if that happens, and it is possible to assemble the transmission with the shifter with its arm pointing down.
Third, it's very easy to forget the counter shaft thrust washer (item 32) in the parts manual.
Don't be tempted to insert the transmission by tightening the four 5/16 bolts no matter how desirable it looks. It should slide almost all the way home by hand.
Finally, before you declare yourself the winner, make damn sure that the shifter works and make it work in all four gears before you begin with the clutch.
Congratulations on bucking up and attacking the transmission. If you want to know exactly what I'm talking about re use of the dremel, call me at 850 591 5702.
Second: Don't recall whether your bike is RH or LH shift. In both cases you've got to ensure that the shifter 'ball' is exactly where it belongs. In the case of a LH shifter, the shaft goes through the trap door, so it's quite a bit easier. you cam insert the transmission with one hand and hold the shifter in place throughout the insertion process. With the RH shifter it's a bit more tricky, but suffice it to say that you have to arrange the shifter so that the arm is sticking out horizontally. I mark the end of the splined shaft with a line parallel to the shifter arm.
There is risk that the shifter rotates a bit and winds up pointing at the bottom of the case. It won't shift if that happens, and it is possible to assemble the transmission with the shifter with its arm pointing down.
Third, it's very easy to forget the counter shaft thrust washer (item 32) in the parts manual.
Don't be tempted to insert the transmission by tightening the four 5/16 bolts no matter how desirable it looks. It should slide almost all the way home by hand.
Finally, before you declare yourself the winner, make damn sure that the shifter works and make it work in all four gears before you begin with the clutch.
Congratulations on bucking up and attacking the transmission. If you want to know exactly what I'm talking about re use of the dremel, call me at 850 591 5702.
Last edited by halmc; Jun 30, 2009 at 06:44 AM.