$5,000 gamble
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6th Gear
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 11
Likes: 2
From: Lakeville, MN
$5,000 gamble
Gambling on the warranty being rejected, especially a first year production motor, is a gamble I'm not willing to take. So any performance upgrades I make will be within the guidelines to keep the warranty intact.
There has been much talk about the Harley/EPA agreement and how it impacts warranty. If you swapped out the exhaust system from the heads back, and had a problem, who would know if you put the stock exhaust back on before bringing it in? My concern is if you use a tuner other than the Harley SE Pro Street does the ECM know what's attached to it and keep track? Sure many tuners allow you to reload the stock or previous tune/map but if the ECM tracks what hardware has been attached to it, HD by their agreement with the EPA has to deny the claim.
- Dave
Big brother is very near! Motorcycles will eventually have cell or WiFi on them, think Onstar/comm options. When this happens then tracking and sending any non approved changes to the mother ship as they occur will be SOP.
There has been much talk about the Harley/EPA agreement and how it impacts warranty. If you swapped out the exhaust system from the heads back, and had a problem, who would know if you put the stock exhaust back on before bringing it in? My concern is if you use a tuner other than the Harley SE Pro Street does the ECM know what's attached to it and keep track? Sure many tuners allow you to reload the stock or previous tune/map but if the ECM tracks what hardware has been attached to it, HD by their agreement with the EPA has to deny the claim.
- Dave
Big brother is very near! Motorcycles will eventually have cell or WiFi on them, think Onstar/comm options. When this happens then tracking and sending any non approved changes to the mother ship as they occur will be SOP.
Last edited by dronning; Apr 24, 2017 at 01:48 PM. Reason: clarity
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 2,530
Likes: 546
From: Wayne County, PA
I remember reading how the bikes with GPS track your speed and location and sell the info to the highest bidder. I hate technology. Especially with no more privacy for this info due to the recent changing of the information act.
Edit: similar to the way adds pop up for things the cia thinks you might like
Edit: similar to the way adds pop up for things the cia thinks you might like
Road Warrior
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,512
Likes: 345
From: Ohio
I'm not really worrying about it. I'm enjoying my bike stock for right now but its more a matter of figuring out what I want to do with it more than anything else. I bought it in November, I'll probably ride it stock up until November or Dec and start changing things then.
I wasted some money on 'upgrades' that didn't really do anything for me on my last bike. This one runs pretty damn well just as it is.
I wasted some money on 'upgrades' that didn't really do anything for me on my last bike. This one runs pretty damn well just as it is.
I'm not really worrying about it. I'm enjoying my bike stock for right now but its more a matter of figuring out what I want to do with it more than anything else. I bought it in November, I'll probably ride it stock up until November or Dec and start changing things then.
I wasted some money on 'upgrades' that didn't really do anything for me on my last bike. This one runs pretty damn well just as it is.
I wasted some money on 'upgrades' that didn't really do anything for me on my last bike. This one runs pretty damn well just as it is.
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Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 23,003
Likes: 11,441
The M8 is staying stock at least for now. A first for me. I am happy with it. Not saying I can hold out for the life of the bike but no mods other than lights and controls.
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Road Captain
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 519
Likes: 83
From: NC
Yes, Harley can tell if an ECM has been flashed even if the original tune has been restored. When the bike is plugged into the Digitial Technician, it connects to MOCO to see if any updates are needed and transmits info about the bike. The ECM keeps track of if it's been flashed, and how many times. Let's say you flashed your ECM with a FP3 and then you had a problem and restored the original tune. Harley would know it's been flashed because the ECM would identify that it's been flashed two times. MOCO would know it's been flashed by a non-Harley tuner because flashes by a Harley tuner are transmitted to MOCO. If MOCO sees two flashes and no corresponding Harley tuner flashes then they know an aftermarket tuner has been used. This stuff that restoring the original map will fool MOCO is false. I posed this question to a dealer and he showed me a Digital Tech printout and sure enough the number of flashes had been recorded. Why would MOCO pay Delphi to develop and ECM and not track it? MOCO has just been lenient.
Last edited by PeteF; Apr 24, 2017 at 04:03 PM.
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,325
Likes: 333
From: Upper Providence Pa
Not to agree or disagree but, the MOCO can record number of flashes as you shared the dealer showed you. The Harley tuner is also a downloadable software on a PC and anyone with the cable can make minor adjustment to the tune and flash the ecm as many times as they like from the comfort of there own home. MOCO can not accurately determine types of flash whether its a SE flash or a fp3 or dynojet, just that it has been flashed by the number of bits written to the ecm.
And as stated many many times over, if your going to "Mess"with it, you take the chance of owning it if things go wrong.
And as stated many many times over, if your going to "Mess"with it, you take the chance of owning it if things go wrong.