Cam install questions.
Thread Starter
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Road Master
Joined: Mar 2024
Posts: 1,160
Likes: 511
From: Colorado
Yeap, and to add to this you don't even have to remove the oil pump. There's just enough clearance for the lifters to be dropped out of their bores and put back in without pulling the pump out.
I personally used Magnetic Lifter Holders from 9FNGR Fab.
If I could do it again I wouldnt bother with the cuffs for just stage 2.
If I was, I'd go for one of them induction coils I've seen people suggest. 200$ coil coulda saved me 245$... such is life.
That being said, about those lifter cuffs. I had to re align one cuff to make sure my Wood Plat Lifters fell up and down freely, even though my feuling lifters fell up and down freely before disassembly. So I'd just make sure your cuffs aren't having any rubbing/clearance issues.
Also I would measure the sprocket alignment, a straight edge and shim kit isn't super expensive.
I remeasured mine when I did the 22XE cam install even though I had done it before. I had shimmed it correctly the first time so It was probably unecessary but if you're swapping the first time, Might as well.
I personally used Magnetic Lifter Holders from 9FNGR Fab.
If I could do it again I wouldnt bother with the cuffs for just stage 2.
If I was, I'd go for one of them induction coils I've seen people suggest. 200$ coil coulda saved me 245$... such is life.
That being said, about those lifter cuffs. I had to re align one cuff to make sure my Wood Plat Lifters fell up and down freely, even though my feuling lifters fell up and down freely before disassembly. So I'd just make sure your cuffs aren't having any rubbing/clearance issues.
Also I would measure the sprocket alignment, a straight edge and shim kit isn't super expensive.
I remeasured mine when I did the 22XE cam install even though I had done it before. I had shimmed it correctly the first time so It was probably unecessary but if you're swapping the first time, Might as well.
You mean induction heaters like this....
HDF Community Team
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 4,347
Likes: 3,392
From: Seattle
There is a video where you use a couple feeler guage to maintain clearances on the lifters. I have the cuffs... At this point I'd have to return them. Not like there isn't plenty of other stuff to get... But ya, I'll probably just roll with them, even though it's no big deal, and entails significant risk... My kind of fun.
You mean induction heaters like this....
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ku1-7s4YgRk
You mean induction heaters like this....
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ku1-7s4YgRk
It's a magnetic coil that heats up bolts so they release the loctite.
Last edited by FranBunnyFFXII; Dec 15, 2024 at 03:15 AM.
Thread Starter
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Road Master
Joined: Mar 2024
Posts: 1,160
Likes: 511
From: Colorado
I'm talking about this thing
https://www.amazon.com/Solary-Magnet...dp/B0851C6Q22?
It's a magnetic coil that heats up bolts so they release the loctite.
https://www.amazon.com/Solary-Magnet...dp/B0851C6Q22?
It's a magnetic coil that heats up bolts so they release the loctite.
Must be new bolt cause you can't spin them off by hand. We would heat then tap with hammer. When the ping went to hollow, they were done and you would get the slugging wrench or limi-torque on them.
No direct flame is good, but I don't know that I have a need for that. I'm not doing production work. A little heat helps a lot and I will certainly use some on the known problem bolts.
Thread Starter
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Road Master
Joined: Mar 2024
Posts: 1,160
Likes: 511
From: Colorado
So another question... The procedure is to stack the parts back in, snug the cam plate down, rotate back tire to rotate oil pump to make sure everything is aligned right, then snug oil pump, and do proper torque of bolts.... So if you don't seperate oil pump and cam plate, and put it all back in... Any reason to go through that procedure? Or just put back in and torque down cam plate?
HDF Community Team
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 4,347
Likes: 3,392
From: Seattle
So another question... The procedure is to stack the parts back in, snug the cam plate down, rotate back tire to rotate oil pump to make sure everything is aligned right, then snug oil pump, and do proper torque of bolts.... So if you don't seperate oil pump and cam plate, and put it all back in... Any reason to go through that procedure? Or just put back in and torque down cam plate?
The separate snug and torque steps allow the plate to align to the pinion shaft, and then another rotation allows the pump to be aligned to the pinion shaft independently so everything is aligned properly.
This is the sequence I use, it's overly paranoid but since I did not measure run out, I wanted to ensure nothing could be off center.
Make sure you applied a generous amount of Assembly Lube
M8 Oil Pump and Camplate Torque Sequence.
Reference: Screamin Eagle Pro Camplate and Oilpump Install instructions PN62400260
You will need a 1/4in Torque small wrench for Inch Pounds.
Touch Snug the bolts in sequence.(1 to 10)
Rotate the Crank Shaft, several times.
Snug the Cam Plate (3 to 8)
15 to 20 inch pounds
Rotate the Crank Shaft, several times.
100inch pound Torque The Cam Plate(3 to 8)
Rotate the Crank Shaft
Snug the Oil Pump(except 9 and 10)
15 to 20 inch pounds
Rotate the Crank Shaft.
100inch pound Torque the Oil Pump.(1,2,9,10)
Rotate the Crank Shaft
Wait.(15min)
110inch pound final Torque full sequence 3 to 8, 1, 2, 9, 10.
Done.
Reference: Screamin Eagle Pro Camplate and Oilpump Install instructions PN62400260
You will need a 1/4in Torque small wrench for Inch Pounds.
Touch Snug the bolts in sequence.(1 to 10)
Rotate the Crank Shaft, several times.
Snug the Cam Plate (3 to 8)
15 to 20 inch pounds
Rotate the Crank Shaft, several times.
100inch pound Torque The Cam Plate(3 to 8)
Rotate the Crank Shaft
Snug the Oil Pump(except 9 and 10)
15 to 20 inch pounds
Rotate the Crank Shaft.
100inch pound Torque the Oil Pump.(1,2,9,10)
Rotate the Crank Shaft
Wait.(15min)
110inch pound final Torque full sequence 3 to 8, 1, 2, 9, 10.
Done.
Last edited by FranBunnyFFXII; Dec 22, 2024 at 02:18 AM.
Thread Starter
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Road Master
Joined: Mar 2024
Posts: 1,160
Likes: 511
From: Colorado
Right, but figured if I didn't unbolt the oil pump from the plate, that might not be necessary... But I did ask for that reason. No big deal. I'll just break oil pump bolts loose on disassembly, still remove together, but do proper sequence on assembly to know everything is aligned correctly.
HDF Community Team
Joined: Oct 2018
Posts: 4,347
Likes: 3,392
From: Seattle
Right, but figured if I didn't unbolt the oil pump from the plate, that might not be necessary... But I did ask for that reason. No big deal. I'll just break oil pump bolts loose on disassembly, still remove together, but do proper sequence on assembly to know everything is aligned correctly.
The pump itself kind pops into place, and will stay in the camchest if you do not forcibly remove it.
You can remove the lifters from their bores without removing the pump.
If you do not remove the pump then you dont have to worry about replacing that O-ring that seals it in, or the seal on the back of the pump, or risk pinching the O-ring when reseating the pump. You only have to replace the o-ring that mates with the camplate.
Not pulling the pump saves a bunch of time since you wont have to reassemble it back on the pinion shaft. Even if you leave it bolted to the camplate and pull the entire thing out as one piece, you might have trouble realigning all the internals back up without an alignment tool, making you unbolt everything and reassemble it again anyways. IMO leaving the pump in there all nice and locked into place makes it easier.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 19,922
Likes: 8,027
From: poway
I might be forgetting a detail since it's been a while since I read the thread. You're NOT replacing the pump right?
The pump itself kind pops into place, and will stay in the camchest if you do not forcibly remove it.
You can remove the lifters from their bores without removing the pump.
If you do not remove the pump then you dont have to worry about replacing that O-ring that seals it in, or the seal on the back of the pump, or risk pinching the O-ring when reseating the pump. You only have to replace the o-ring that mates with the camplate.
Not pulling the pump saves a bunch of time since you wont have to reassemble it back on the pinion shaft. Even if you leave it bolted to the camplate and pull the entire thing out as one piece, you might have trouble realigning all the internals back up without an alignment tool, making you unbolt everything and reassemble it again anyways. IMO leaving the pump in there all nice and locked into place makes it easier.
snip
The pump itself kind pops into place, and will stay in the camchest if you do not forcibly remove it.
You can remove the lifters from their bores without removing the pump.
If you do not remove the pump then you dont have to worry about replacing that O-ring that seals it in, or the seal on the back of the pump, or risk pinching the O-ring when reseating the pump. You only have to replace the o-ring that mates with the camplate.
Not pulling the pump saves a bunch of time since you wont have to reassemble it back on the pinion shaft. Even if you leave it bolted to the camplate and pull the entire thing out as one piece, you might have trouble realigning all the internals back up without an alignment tool, making you unbolt everything and reassemble it again anyways. IMO leaving the pump in there all nice and locked into place makes it easier.
snip
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Thread Starter
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Road Master
Joined: Mar 2024
Posts: 1,160
Likes: 511
From: Colorado
The kit comes with new rings which I will replace. This was about whether I have to do a full disassembly of cam plate and oil pump... I don't. But the they are both coming out. I don't know that I will save much time, but I'm not replacing so if I don't have to remove pump from plate then why do it?
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 19,922
Likes: 8,027
From: poway
The kit comes with new rings which I will replace. This was about whether I have to do a full disassembly of cam plate and oil pump... I don't. But the they are both coming out. I don't know that I will save much time, but I'm not replacing so if I don't have to remove pump from plate then why do it?