Fuelpak Question
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Road Warrior
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,784
Likes: 10
From: Chicagoland
Fuelpak Question
I just received my V & H pipes and the fuelpak - on the instructions it says that the fuelpak can only be used with a high performance air cleaner. Is this correct? I can't use the stock air cleaner with this?
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,925
Likes: 5
From:
RE: Fuelpak Question
I doubt it, I can't see using it if you can't get more air into the motor, what would be the point of richening it?
Get yourself an Arlen ness big sucker kit or screaming eagle stage 1 kit, you won't regret it.
Get yourself an Arlen ness big sucker kit or screaming eagle stage 1 kit, you won't regret it.
Tourer
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 422
Likes: 0
From: Brookville, Ohio
RE: Fuelpak Question
.......... Just my thoughts on the whole air/fuel/exhaust issue:
Fuel injected models are a little more complex than carb models so we have to deal with electronics.
Installing the pipes doesn't change how much air/fuel mix goes into the engine (at least not enough to make a signifigant difference). With a given amout of air you need a given amount of fuel for proper mix. The stock ECM is 'mapped' with certain parameters for a stock intake and stock pipes. The amount of air/fuel is based on how the ECM is 'mapped' or programmed for air/fuel mix at any rpm etc. The ECM doesn't know you changed the pipes and really doesn't care so there won't be too much difference in the way it runs. It has been programmed to do a certain job. So, changing the ECM mapping with a FuelPak or anything else may not help much without adding some more air.
To get the most benifit from the pipes, you will need more air/fuel mix and that is done with an air intake upgrade along with a FuelPak, PCIII or SERT. The FuelPak, PCIII or SERT will balance the mix for better performance. I think the FuelPak would be the easiest route. Others may think differently. The FuelPak will allow you to use the stock ECM download or the Stage I download which usually runs $150.00 or so + tech time. But you can 'do it yourself' with the stock ECM program and save a bunch.
If you change your exhaust, change your air intake, use the stock download map on the factory ECM and install the FuelPak you should be is good shape.
You have already spent a pile of money on the pipes and FuelPak. Another $140.00 or so for an air intake kit will be money well spent.
Just my thoughts ..........
Fuel injected models are a little more complex than carb models so we have to deal with electronics.
Installing the pipes doesn't change how much air/fuel mix goes into the engine (at least not enough to make a signifigant difference). With a given amout of air you need a given amount of fuel for proper mix. The stock ECM is 'mapped' with certain parameters for a stock intake and stock pipes. The amount of air/fuel is based on how the ECM is 'mapped' or programmed for air/fuel mix at any rpm etc. The ECM doesn't know you changed the pipes and really doesn't care so there won't be too much difference in the way it runs. It has been programmed to do a certain job. So, changing the ECM mapping with a FuelPak or anything else may not help much without adding some more air.
To get the most benifit from the pipes, you will need more air/fuel mix and that is done with an air intake upgrade along with a FuelPak, PCIII or SERT. The FuelPak, PCIII or SERT will balance the mix for better performance. I think the FuelPak would be the easiest route. Others may think differently. The FuelPak will allow you to use the stock ECM download or the Stage I download which usually runs $150.00 or so + tech time. But you can 'do it yourself' with the stock ECM program and save a bunch.
If you change your exhaust, change your air intake, use the stock download map on the factory ECM and install the FuelPak you should be is good shape.
You have already spent a pile of money on the pipes and FuelPak. Another $140.00 or so for an air intake kit will be money well spent.
Just my thoughts ..........
Stage II
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
RE: Fuelpak Question
Gents,
I hope I havent missed the boat with this one. I have a 06 Nightrain fitted with short shots big air cleaner and hypercharger and I am currently considering a V and H fuelpak. Would the addition of this fuel pak increase performance?
Regards
Cougarcatman from down under.
I hope I havent missed the boat with this one. I have a 06 Nightrain fitted with short shots big air cleaner and hypercharger and I am currently considering a V and H fuelpak. Would the addition of this fuel pak increase performance?
Regards
Cougarcatman from down under.
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,925
Likes: 5
From:
RE: Fuelpak Question
If you have changed your pipes and intake, but do not have either the HD download, or some form of remap, by all means you need to invest in some form of enrichening unit.
I currently just have the HD remap, which works ok. there is the screaming eagle race tuner - or SERT which changes your ecm settings with no further additions. Advantage is you have no hardware installed under your seat and most people love the performance. Disadvantage - it is "married" to your ecm and you cannot re-use it on any other bike you may get, also from what I have heard, if you decide you want to change to a PCIII, you mave have to replace your ecm.
Now, the PCIII is another great way to go. Advantages - It is easily removable and can be remaped for a different bike if you sell, trade. Disadvantage- it is a separate piece of hardware and needs to be mounted under the seat somewhere.
The fuelpak is also a hardware device, the only disadvantage I can think of is that if you get the bike dyno-tuned, they might not be as familiar with the fuel pack as they would the others.
I currently just have the HD remap, which works ok. there is the screaming eagle race tuner - or SERT which changes your ecm settings with no further additions. Advantage is you have no hardware installed under your seat and most people love the performance. Disadvantage - it is "married" to your ecm and you cannot re-use it on any other bike you may get, also from what I have heard, if you decide you want to change to a PCIII, you mave have to replace your ecm.
Now, the PCIII is another great way to go. Advantages - It is easily removable and can be remaped for a different bike if you sell, trade. Disadvantage- it is a separate piece of hardware and needs to be mounted under the seat somewhere.
The fuelpak is also a hardware device, the only disadvantage I can think of is that if you get the bike dyno-tuned, they might not be as familiar with the fuel pack as they would the others.
Road Warrior
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,578
Likes: 0
From:
RE: Fuelpak Question
ORIGINAL: smittyp83
I just received my V & H pipes and the fuelpak - on the instructions it says that the fuelpak can only be used with a high performance air cleaner. Is this correct? I can't use the stock air cleaner with this?
I just received my V & H pipes and the fuelpak - on the instructions it says that the fuelpak can only be used with a high performance air cleaner. Is this correct? I can't use the stock air cleaner with this?
HD told me not to run it without Race tuner ,Fuel pack or PCIII, they said the down load would help but was
not the correct way to run it.
I choose the PC and the bike runs great.
I had a bit of trouble but its back to norm . I say its the way to go
the maps can be changed it seconds
Good luck
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RE: Fuelpak Question
ORIGINAL: smittyp83
Thanks for the input. I'm looking into new air cleaners now - probably either a Big Sucker or SE.
Hopefully, that's it!
Thanks for the input. I'm looking into new air cleaners now - probably either a Big Sucker or SE.
Hopefully, that's it!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ARLEN...mZ140052851114
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Elite HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,592
Likes: 6
From: Florida
RE: Fuelpak Question
If you have the sert download you can still re-tune it or tune around it with the PC. I have not seen a bike where locating the PC under the seat was an issue. I had my PC and my brake/run/signal controller both stashed under the seat of my 05 Nightrain.
ORIGINAL: monkyman
If you have changed your pipes and intake, but do not have either the HD download, or some form of remap, by all means you need to invest in some form of enrichening unit.
I currently just have the HD remap, which works ok. there is the screaming eagle race tuner - or SERT which changes your ecm settings with no further additions. Advantage is you have no hardware installed under your seat and most people love the performance. Disadvantage - it is "married" to your ecm and you cannot re-use it on any other bike you may get, also from what I have heard, if you decide you want to change to a PCIII, you mave have to replace your ecm.
Now, the PCIII is another great way to go. Advantages - It is easily removable and can be remaped for a different bike if you sell, trade. Disadvantage- it is a separate piece of hardware and needs to be mounted under the seat somewhere.
The fuelpak is also a hardware device, the only disadvantage I can think of is that if you get the bike dyno-tuned, they might not be as familiar with the fuel pack as they would the others.
If you have changed your pipes and intake, but do not have either the HD download, or some form of remap, by all means you need to invest in some form of enrichening unit.
I currently just have the HD remap, which works ok. there is the screaming eagle race tuner - or SERT which changes your ecm settings with no further additions. Advantage is you have no hardware installed under your seat and most people love the performance. Disadvantage - it is "married" to your ecm and you cannot re-use it on any other bike you may get, also from what I have heard, if you decide you want to change to a PCIII, you mave have to replace your ecm.
Now, the PCIII is another great way to go. Advantages - It is easily removable and can be remaped for a different bike if you sell, trade. Disadvantage- it is a separate piece of hardware and needs to be mounted under the seat somewhere.
The fuelpak is also a hardware device, the only disadvantage I can think of is that if you get the bike dyno-tuned, they might not be as familiar with the fuel pack as they would the others.