Problem with my Night Train
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Tourer
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 311
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From: South Carolina
Problem with my Night Train
I have a 2006 FXSTB carbureted NT that just today started acting a fool. Took the ol lady to go get Sunday breakfast and halfway there (about 10 miles in) I noticed the turn signals would not come on, left or right or hazards. I pull over and notice that in first gear when letting out the clutch the bike lunges a little bit like it's about to choke out but when throttle is applied all is good. I turn the ignition off then back on and test the turn signals and when you press one, doesn't matter which) it will come on but you can not manually turn it off. Also when you make a turn and it finally does turn off you can't get either turn signals to come back on unless you power down.
Took her to the house and ran some tests in the shop, found that the turn signals would cut on and off for approximately the first 2 minutes after start up but after 2 minutes elapsed they would no longer work. Also noted that my brake light is on all the time and engaging either my front or rear breaks have no effect on the light. I ran a diagnostic on the speedo and I am pulling two codes, both are in the P (Ignition Control Module) section. They are:
P0374 -CKP Sensor Not Detected
P0562 - Battery Voltage Low
Does this sound like something that would be caused by a bad CKP sensor, and surely the battery being a little low wouldn't cause these problems. Or does it sound like I might have an ICM that's gone nutty? Any advice would be helpful. The bike is under a warranty that I purchased when I bought it through Harley but I have been reading and wrenching a lot on my own bike and want to learn as much as possible so I can fix my own problems when the warranty runs out. Thanks in advance!
Took her to the house and ran some tests in the shop, found that the turn signals would cut on and off for approximately the first 2 minutes after start up but after 2 minutes elapsed they would no longer work. Also noted that my brake light is on all the time and engaging either my front or rear breaks have no effect on the light. I ran a diagnostic on the speedo and I am pulling two codes, both are in the P (Ignition Control Module) section. They are:
P0374 -CKP Sensor Not Detected
P0562 - Battery Voltage Low
Does this sound like something that would be caused by a bad CKP sensor, and surely the battery being a little low wouldn't cause these problems. Or does it sound like I might have an ICM that's gone nutty? Any advice would be helpful. The bike is under a warranty that I purchased when I bought it through Harley but I have been reading and wrenching a lot on my own bike and want to learn as much as possible so I can fix my own problems when the warranty runs out. Thanks in advance!
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Tourer
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 311
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From: South Carolina
Well after tracing out the schematic in my owners manual I believe I have two issues. I believe that I need to replace my crank position sensor to solve idling issues and I've been fighting the "hard to start when hot" situation for a bit anyway. I'll have to ohm it out to be sure.
I also think my TSM/TSSM has gone bad as that's where all my lights get signals from. Anyone else ever had one go bad and what were your symptoms?
I also think my TSM/TSSM has gone bad as that's where all my lights get signals from. Anyone else ever had one go bad and what were your symptoms?
Check out your speed sensor as well. Short version, during my speedo relo I hooked it up directly to the new speedo which took it completely out of the ECM loop. I suffered from random stalling issues and it also plays a role in the self cancel function of the signals.
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Tourer
Joined: Sep 2012
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From: South Carolina
I took it to the dealership today. Man, talk about taking your baby to the doctor and feel like you're waiting on a prognosis from the doctor 
Funny thing is that the same symptoms from yesterday disappeared today on the way to the dealer (of course). But I did get a new symptom that if I apply the brakes, I cannot turn a turn signal on, but if I let off the brakes it will come on. Hitting the brakes once it's on does not cancel them out. This also was only reproducible after riding for about 10 minutes.
Talking with the tech about the Crank Positioning Sensor he said that it is either bad or work, there is no inbetween symptoms. Either the bike runs or you're stranded....does that sound right?
Funny thing is that the same symptoms from yesterday disappeared today on the way to the dealer (of course). But I did get a new symptom that if I apply the brakes, I cannot turn a turn signal on, but if I let off the brakes it will come on. Hitting the brakes once it's on does not cancel them out. This also was only reproducible after riding for about 10 minutes.
Talking with the tech about the Crank Positioning Sensor he said that it is either bad or work, there is no inbetween symptoms. Either the bike runs or you're stranded....does that sound right?
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Tourer
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 311
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From: South Carolina
So Harley called me and said that I have a wiring issue with the brake system and they've narrowed it down to one wire but they won't go any further until I authorize them for at least one more hour of labor. They say that they can't guarantee the repair, diagnostic, or labor thus far will be covered under my warranty until after they get that far.
Why do I feel like my warranty was just an expensive piece of trash? I get the feeling they are going to try and stick this to me cause they keep asking have I done anything to the bike to alter it from stock....
Why do I feel like my warranty was just an expensive piece of trash? I get the feeling they are going to try and stick this to me cause they keep asking have I done anything to the bike to alter it from stock....
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Joined: May 2007
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From: 40 miles Northeast of Indy..
So Harley called me and said that I have a wiring issue with the brake system and they've narrowed it down to one wire but they won't go any further until I authorize them for at least one more hour of labor. They say that they can't guarantee the repair, diagnostic, or labor thus far will be covered under my warranty until after they get that far.
Why do I feel like my warranty was just an expensive piece of trash? I get the feeling they are going to try and stick this to me cause they keep asking have I done anything to the bike to alter it from stock....
Why do I feel like my warranty was just an expensive piece of trash? I get the feeling they are going to try and stick this to me cause they keep asking have I done anything to the bike to alter it from stock....
As far as the dealer sticking it to U, Trouble shooting is not easy or cheap..
As to why they ask If U've done anything to U bike's Elc, its because it can make a big difference of what they look for or what its needs.
Too many dudes work on their bikes and make changes to the wiring in the bars and or lighting that U'd never even change a light bulb in Ur house.
U can't expect anyone to fix a major freak up in a couple mins on a bike that some one has really jacked it up.
.
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Tourer
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 311
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From: South Carolina
Nah I get all that, I do service work myself and understand that sometimes you have to see how far down the rabbit hole goes before you can find the problem and charging accordingly. I just don't like it when they were talking like if the rear tire has been bottoming out and the tire rubbed the wiring it wouldn't be covered under warranty, and things like that. Just sounded like the warranty was great if the bike was all stock, never ridden hard, and you didn't step in a loop hole.
Maybe I'm just being cynical. Being in a service industry that deals with a lof of "warranties" I've seen so many ways that insurance companies try to get out of paying the bill. At least the service guy working on my bike seemed like a cool dude, maybe all will work well. We shall find out tomorrow after they get through pulling the tank!
Maybe I'm just being cynical. Being in a service industry that deals with a lof of "warranties" I've seen so many ways that insurance companies try to get out of paying the bill. At least the service guy working on my bike seemed like a cool dude, maybe all will work well. We shall find out tomorrow after they get through pulling the tank!
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Cruiser
Joined: Jun 2012
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From: Culpeper, VA
Nah I get all that, I do service work myself and understand that sometimes you have to see how far down the rabbit hole goes before you can find the problem and charging accordingly. I just don't like it when they were talking like if the rear tire has been bottoming out and the tire rubbed the wiring it wouldn't be covered under warranty, and things like that. Just sounded like the warranty was great if the bike was all stock, never ridden hard, and you didn't step in a loop hole.
Maybe I'm just being cynical. Being in a service industry that deals with a lof of "warranties" I've seen so many ways that insurance companies try to get out of paying the bill. At least the service guy working on my bike seemed like a cool dude, maybe all will work well. We shall find out tomorrow after they get through pulling the tank!
Maybe I'm just being cynical. Being in a service industry that deals with a lof of "warranties" I've seen so many ways that insurance companies try to get out of paying the bill. At least the service guy working on my bike seemed like a cool dude, maybe all will work well. We shall find out tomorrow after they get through pulling the tank!
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Joined: Jul 2008
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From: north jersey
that sucks man !! i hate it when my bike is not running right.
I rode it today and heard a "clanking" noise coming from the neck. Turns out to be just a loose fall away nut, which took 10 minutes to re-tighten. But it drove me nuts listening to that clanking on the way home. I could imagine how aggravated I would be if the electrical gremlin got a hold of my bike.
good luck to you and let us know what the issue turns out to be and what the stealer does for ya !!
I rode it today and heard a "clanking" noise coming from the neck. Turns out to be just a loose fall away nut, which took 10 minutes to re-tighten. But it drove me nuts listening to that clanking on the way home. I could imagine how aggravated I would be if the electrical gremlin got a hold of my bike.
good luck to you and let us know what the issue turns out to be and what the stealer does for ya !!
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