DYNOJET: Tune with closed/open loop together?
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Cruiser
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 101
Likes: 5
From: AZ
Tune with closed/open loop together?
Ok, so this is new to me(Dynojets open/closed loop combo). I have tuned the bike with closed loop. Got it to run GREAT. I have used Autotune and then took the autotune off and ran it open loop.
I was told by an individual at Dynonet to run it in open/closed loop with the stock O2 sensors in the bike and below 40% throttle and 3250Rpms my bike will run in closed loop between 14.4-14.7AFR(this is considered the Cruise range) outside this range it goes into open loop and will run where i tell it to. In the “open loop” part of the map it runs Strong and fine like it did in FULL open loop.
These are my questions and reason for th post.
when i first started the bike and rode it in “closed loop” it ran like CRAP. Stumbling and just nasty. How long does it take the ECM to learn the AFRs being put out by the engine.
Should i unplug the ECU and “reset” it? I’m gonna give it a couple days and try to see if the conditions improve. If not I’m going back to FULL open loop and gonna forget about MPG until i get a new tuner...
ANYBODY done it this way?
I was told by an individual at Dynonet to run it in open/closed loop with the stock O2 sensors in the bike and below 40% throttle and 3250Rpms my bike will run in closed loop between 14.4-14.7AFR(this is considered the Cruise range) outside this range it goes into open loop and will run where i tell it to. In the “open loop” part of the map it runs Strong and fine like it did in FULL open loop.
These are my questions and reason for th post.
when i first started the bike and rode it in “closed loop” it ran like CRAP. Stumbling and just nasty. How long does it take the ECM to learn the AFRs being put out by the engine.
Should i unplug the ECU and “reset” it? I’m gonna give it a couple days and try to see if the conditions improve. If not I’m going back to FULL open loop and gonna forget about MPG until i get a new tuner...
ANYBODY done it this way?
Last edited by FREDStr33tbob; Jan 30, 2019 at 09:20 PM.
Tourer
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 298
Likes: 103
From: King Island, Tasmania
Ok, so this is new to me(Dynojets open/closed loop combo). I have tuned the bike with closed loop. Got it to run GREAT. I have used Autotune and then took the autotune off and ran it open loop.
By Auto tune do you mean target tune? You mentioned taking it off is why I ask.
I was told by an individual at Dynonet to run it in open/closed loop with the stock O2 sensors in the bike and below 40% throttle and 3250Rpms my bike will run in closed loop between 14.4-14.7AFR(this is considered the Cruise range) outside this range it goes into open loop and will run where i tell it to. In the open loop part of the map it runs Strong and fine like it did in FULL open loop.
It will run the AFR as you have in the table, 14.7 is not Harley friendly, that advice is wrong, when did you have it in full open loop?
These are my questions and reason for th post.
when i first started the bike and rode it in closed loop it ran like CRAP. Stumbling and just nasty. How long does it take the ECM to learn the AFRs being put out by the engine.
If it's been tuned properly it is instant, if it's running like crap something is not right.
Should i unplug the ECU and reset it? Im gonna give it a couple days and try to see if the conditions improve. If not Im going back to FULL open loop and gonna forget about MPG until i get a new tuner...
i don't know what you mean by unplug the ECM, mpg is the least of of your worries, not sure what's going on here.
ANYBODY done it this way?
Mate it sounds like you have gone in cold here, terminology aside it sounds like you should read the manual again, I'm really not trying to be a smart ****, power vision is not my thing but you should be getting better results than this.
By Auto tune do you mean target tune? You mentioned taking it off is why I ask.
I was told by an individual at Dynonet to run it in open/closed loop with the stock O2 sensors in the bike and below 40% throttle and 3250Rpms my bike will run in closed loop between 14.4-14.7AFR(this is considered the Cruise range) outside this range it goes into open loop and will run where i tell it to. In the open loop part of the map it runs Strong and fine like it did in FULL open loop.
It will run the AFR as you have in the table, 14.7 is not Harley friendly, that advice is wrong, when did you have it in full open loop?
These are my questions and reason for th post.
when i first started the bike and rode it in closed loop it ran like CRAP. Stumbling and just nasty. How long does it take the ECM to learn the AFRs being put out by the engine.
If it's been tuned properly it is instant, if it's running like crap something is not right.
Should i unplug the ECU and reset it? Im gonna give it a couple days and try to see if the conditions improve. If not Im going back to FULL open loop and gonna forget about MPG until i get a new tuner...
i don't know what you mean by unplug the ECM, mpg is the least of of your worries, not sure what's going on here.
ANYBODY done it this way?
Mate it sounds like you have gone in cold here, terminology aside it sounds like you should read the manual again, I'm really not trying to be a smart ****, power vision is not my thing but you should be getting better results than this.
Maybe someone more versed in PV can read between the lines and jump in here.
Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 101
Likes: 5
From: AZ
Quote:
Originally Posted by FREDStr33tbob
Ok, so this is new to me(Dynojets open/closed loop combo). I have tuned the bike with closed loop. Got it to run GREAT. I have used Autotune and then took the autotune off and ran it open loop.
By Auto tune do you mean target tune? You mentioned taking it off is why I ask.
No it was an AUTOTUNE for a PCV
I was told by an individual at Dynonet to run it in open/closed loop with the stock O2 sensors in the bike and below 40% throttle and 3250Rpms my bike will run in closed loop between 14.4-14.7AFR(this is considered the Cruise range) outside this range it goes into open loop and will run where i tell it to. In the “open loop” part of the map it runs Strong and fine like it did in FULL open loop.
It will run the AFR as you have in the table, 14.7 is not Harley friendly, that advice is wrong, when did you have it in full open loop?
If you have a power commander and take the autotune off after you tune the bike and put plugs in the exhaust, its considered open loop.
and Harley from the factory from what ive read is 14.4/7.
These are my questions and reason for th post.
when i first started the bike and rode it in “closed loop” it ran like CRAP. Stumbling and just nasty. How long does it take the ECM to learn the AFRs being put out by the engine.
If it's been tuned properly it is instant, if it's running like crap something is not right.
I put the table back to 0's in the <3250 and <40% throttle table to see how it will run in the harley closed loop settings. and the bike is getting better each ride.
Should i unplug the ECU and “reset” it? I’m gonna give it a couple days and try to see if the conditions improve. If not I’m going back to FULL open loop and gonna forget about MPG until i get a new tuner...
i don't know what you mean by unplug the ECM, mpg is the least of of your worries, not sure what's going on here.
and power and MPG are both relevant. WOT the bike runs like it should. nobody care about gas mileage at 100% throttle. but when im cruising around or commuting im not WOT all the time. NOBODY IS. so yes i care about the MPG i get cause i dont want to spend 100 miles on the road and then back to the gas station.
ANYBODY done it this way?
Mate it sounds like you have gone in cold here, terminology aside it sounds like you should read the manual again, I'm really not trying to be a smart ****, power vision is not my thing but you should be getting better results than this.
Again not a powervision. and im not someone who doesnt do his homework. i have read more on this than you would think. its A PCV not a powervision.
Maybe someone more versed in PV can read between the lines and jump in here.
Originally Posted by FREDStr33tbob
Ok, so this is new to me(Dynojets open/closed loop combo). I have tuned the bike with closed loop. Got it to run GREAT. I have used Autotune and then took the autotune off and ran it open loop.
By Auto tune do you mean target tune? You mentioned taking it off is why I ask.
No it was an AUTOTUNE for a PCV
I was told by an individual at Dynonet to run it in open/closed loop with the stock O2 sensors in the bike and below 40% throttle and 3250Rpms my bike will run in closed loop between 14.4-14.7AFR(this is considered the Cruise range) outside this range it goes into open loop and will run where i tell it to. In the “open loop” part of the map it runs Strong and fine like it did in FULL open loop.
It will run the AFR as you have in the table, 14.7 is not Harley friendly, that advice is wrong, when did you have it in full open loop?
If you have a power commander and take the autotune off after you tune the bike and put plugs in the exhaust, its considered open loop.
and Harley from the factory from what ive read is 14.4/7.
These are my questions and reason for th post.
when i first started the bike and rode it in “closed loop” it ran like CRAP. Stumbling and just nasty. How long does it take the ECM to learn the AFRs being put out by the engine.
If it's been tuned properly it is instant, if it's running like crap something is not right.
I put the table back to 0's in the <3250 and <40% throttle table to see how it will run in the harley closed loop settings. and the bike is getting better each ride.
Should i unplug the ECU and “reset” it? I’m gonna give it a couple days and try to see if the conditions improve. If not I’m going back to FULL open loop and gonna forget about MPG until i get a new tuner...
i don't know what you mean by unplug the ECM, mpg is the least of of your worries, not sure what's going on here.
and power and MPG are both relevant. WOT the bike runs like it should. nobody care about gas mileage at 100% throttle. but when im cruising around or commuting im not WOT all the time. NOBODY IS. so yes i care about the MPG i get cause i dont want to spend 100 miles on the road and then back to the gas station.
ANYBODY done it this way?
Mate it sounds like you have gone in cold here, terminology aside it sounds like you should read the manual again, I'm really not trying to be a smart ****, power vision is not my thing but you should be getting better results than this.
Again not a powervision. and im not someone who doesnt do his homework. i have read more on this than you would think. its A PCV not a powervision.
Maybe someone more versed in PV can read between the lines and jump in here.
Last edited by FREDStr33tbob; Jan 31, 2019 at 08:30 AM.
Tourer
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 298
Likes: 103
From: King Island, Tasmania
Very sorry, I didn't see PC5 in the original post, I would unplug it, throw it in the bin, get a proper flash tuning device, tune it and power with mpg would follow, best of luck with it all.
Road Warrior
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,923
Likes: 587
From: Alorton, Illinois
If you are using the 5. Closed loop with stock sensors will not come into play. You need to set the tuner up to give feedback from the auto tune module from DJ. I get the lower RPM's and idle taken care of then I set that area not to take the feed back. Then I work higher loads and then I take that out of closed loop. Then I spend my time in the cruise area.
It is closed loop feedback but it isn't controlling your fueling. It is setting trims in the table and trims need to be pulled up and accepted before they take affect. Because of this. 14.3 is usually what I target for cruise. This will be a bit richer because of fuel we have in this area.
I don't know year and model, but with the 5. You are dumbing down a pretty robust fuel injection system with a closed loop feed back system that works better than what is offered in the aftermarket.
It is closed loop feedback but it isn't controlling your fueling. It is setting trims in the table and trims need to be pulled up and accepted before they take affect. Because of this. 14.3 is usually what I target for cruise. This will be a bit richer because of fuel we have in this area.
I don't know year and model, but with the 5. You are dumbing down a pretty robust fuel injection system with a closed loop feed back system that works better than what is offered in the aftermarket.
Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 101
Likes: 5
From: AZ
If you are using the 5. Closed loop with stock sensors will not come into play. You need to set the tuner up to give feedback from the auto tune module from DJ. I get the lower RPM's and idle taken care of then I set that area not to take the feed back. Then I work higher loads and then I take that out of closed loop. Then I spend my time in the cruise area.
It is closed loop feedback but it isn't controlling your fueling. It is setting trims in the table and trims need to be pulled up and accepted before they take affect. Because of this. 14.3 is usually what I target for cruise. This will be a bit richer because of fuel we have in this area.
I don't know year and model, but with the 5. You are dumbing down a pretty robust fuel injection system with a closed loop feed back system that works better than what is offered in the aftermarket.
It is closed loop feedback but it isn't controlling your fueling. It is setting trims in the table and trims need to be pulled up and accepted before they take affect. Because of this. 14.3 is usually what I target for cruise. This will be a bit richer because of fuel we have in this area.
I don't know year and model, but with the 5. You are dumbing down a pretty robust fuel injection system with a closed loop feed back system that works better than what is offered in the aftermarket.
Take the stock O2 sensors and install them. Put 0’s in the fuel map <3250rpms and 40% throttle. It will run in closed loop where the zeros are.(different bike are different in the exact PCV programming in this feature) outside of this range >3250 and 60% throttle and up it will run in open loop. I have ran it this way for a couple days... the first ride was ROUGH. Lol. Each ride continues to get better. You have to ride it to get the ECU to program back to 14.4-14.7 in the 0 part of the map only. Outside this area it runs like I tuned it in Full closed loop with the Powercommander autotune module. STRONG. I was really skeptical at first. I got off the bike and said NO WAY.. but now i have no Check engine light(cause the O2’s were out). Bike is running and idling good. The ECU has tuned out all the stumbling and popping. I have no decelerations popping due to being able to control the timing and at the moment I’m Pretty happy with the running of the bike.
Every map i have come Accross has numbers in the cruise not 0’s. After multiple calls to DynoJet and lots of reading this is the first time i have seen this method of tuning.
I still plan on getting a TTS soon. But its good for now.
Last edited by FREDStr33tbob; Feb 2, 2019 at 11:16 AM.
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Road Warrior
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,923
Likes: 587
From: Alorton, Illinois
That is very interesting. I don't know you could keep factory closed loop while running the 5. Brings up some questions relating to adaptive tables but...... thanks for sharing.
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Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 101
Likes: 5
From: AZ
i was told that they set up all 5s this way. You just have to find the cruise range DJ sets for different bikes..
its crazy, But its working. Lol
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