Primary fill and Comp problems
Elite HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 4,928
Likes: 69
From: Near Myrtle Beach, SC
I am convinced the deflector logic is plain bull ****! The compensator parts spin, spin induces centrifugal force, centrifugal force slings lubrication AWAY from critical areas where it is needed from the spindle outward. Most of the lube in the primary is pushed back toward the clutch plates. Splash lubrication of a constantly spinning part is an ineffective lubrication solution. A failing lubrication strategy for the compensator parts has been proven over the years by the many sporadic failures of HD compensators. And after all this time, nothing much has changed.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 10,135
Likes: 4,778
From: Sandpoint, Idaho
All I do is pull the clutch in and start the bike. If I do not release the clutch prior to putting the bike in gear it NEVER clunks on first start up.
Road Warrior
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,962
Likes: 140
From: NY
I was looking at several diagrams of the factory fill level on the primary of twin cams. The factory fill level seems to be at the bottom of the clutch plates in every diagram ive seen. if you follow a straight edge to the left towards the compensator, the oil level seems to be well below the bearing and everything that needs lubing. If you just pour in 38 ounces of primary oil like the service manual recommends, the the oil level is at the clutch spring and actually almost coming out of the derby cover hole and this is after a thorough drain. now if u run a straight edge over to the compensator, the comp. is much more submerged in an oil bath. Many folks dont have comp issues after 50. 60. 70 thousand miles or so. im wondering if there is a connection here. However. if you fill your primary this high, to the clutch spring, ive noticed louder clunking when shifting. Any thoughts on this?
Too much oil in prim causes clutch to have even more issues fully releasing thus causing a louder clunk sound when shifting
unless you use much thinner ATF that allows clutch plates to release better then proper prim oil does but is questionable when it
comes to longjevity / protection of IPB etc.
Thats why i installed GMR's compensaver (when replacing bad comp at 10k miles with new SE comp kit) to ensure the compensator is properly oiled at all times.
Doing that allows you to 38-40oz prim oil refill lvl when doing prim oil change srv'c without having to cause other issues overfilling prim case in an attempt to introduce additional oil to the compensator to extend it srv'c life.
I have put approx 8k+ miles on the new SE compensator and compensaver with no issues thus far with either of those items.
Scott
Last edited by wscott; Oct 25, 2015 at 09:19 PM.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 11,814
Likes: 5,120
From: SW Ohio
Is it neutral Perk?
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 11,814
Likes: 5,120
From: SW Ohio
I am convinced the deflector logic is plain bull ****! The compensator parts spin, spin induces centrifugal force, centrifugal force slings lubrication AWAY from critical areas where it is needed from the spindle outward. Most of the lube in the primary is pushed back toward the clutch plates. Splash lubrication of a constantly spinning part is an ineffective lubrication solution. A failing lubrication strategy for the compensator parts has been proven over the years by the many sporadic failures of HD compensators. And after all this time, nothing much has changed.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 10,135
Likes: 4,778
From: Sandpoint, Idaho
Yes it is, I start in neutral with clutch pulled. Then put it in gear and start riding. This only works on cold start though. After that you must hold clutch in a bit longer.
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 4,453
Likes: 2,840
From: Oklahoma
For the OP: I understand the machines used by the Motor Cops for the maneuvering demos and contests are over serviced mostly for cooling the clutch which is slipped more than average for the low speed maneuvering. The shop manual gives over servicing as one reason for trouble getting into neutral. I over service mine a few ounces, definitely not to where the lube almost runs out the derby cover hole with the bike upright. I have 62000 miles on my owner installed SE Mark I comp and all seems well.
For LowcountryJoe: Have you looked closely at the latest version comp? It takes advantage of the centrifugal force you mention. The hub area has 6 lube flow holes drilled at an outward angle as they extend from right around the mounting bolt head and go into the inner hub area. Some of the oil slung around the case by the chain is caught and dripped onto the center of the compensator by the oil catcher cup and centrifugal force should sling that oil into the hub area. The earlier design comps don't have those holes and are prone to run dry in the inner hub area. Engines eventually wear out, and I assume these latest compensators will eventually wear out also. Anything made by man etc....
For LowcountryJoe: Have you looked closely at the latest version comp? It takes advantage of the centrifugal force you mention. The hub area has 6 lube flow holes drilled at an outward angle as they extend from right around the mounting bolt head and go into the inner hub area. Some of the oil slung around the case by the chain is caught and dripped onto the center of the compensator by the oil catcher cup and centrifugal force should sling that oil into the hub area. The earlier design comps don't have those holes and are prone to run dry in the inner hub area. Engines eventually wear out, and I assume these latest compensators will eventually wear out also. Anything made by man etc....
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Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 11,814
Likes: 5,120
From: SW Ohio
I'm gonna give that a try. Thanks
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