Daytona tuner...
Road Captain
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 692
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From:
RE: Daytona tuner...
You need to read there site.... there is a lot to get into with it. This givesa quick explanation
http://www.daytona-twintec.com/downl...2_Bulletin.pdf
http://www.daytona-twintec.com/downl...2_Bulletin.pdf
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2006
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From: TX
RE: Daytona tuner...
Correct me if I'm wrong, but Alpha-N & Speed Density are fuel delivery technologies.
It has nothing to do with timing control. In the DTT, timing is adjustable by RPM/MAP, not "just RPM".
It has nothing to do with timing control. In the DTT, timing is adjustable by RPM/MAP, not "just RPM".
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2006
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From: Po-Dunk Looziana
RE: Daytona tuner...
Thanks Phil!
I think it's suffice to say that whatever the user is comfortable with in the Autotune arena is as important as choosing a fuel management system that is to be tuned by a dynotuner according the THEIR familiarity. Simply put, buy what you are most comfortable with tweaking by either you or your dynotuner.
I'm an idiot and the TMax seemed idiot proof.
I only know that it has changed the characteristic of my bike for the better for a plug and play module hence the direction I took with my initial reply. Definitely not attempting to have a pissing contest on which tuner is the best. I'd be the first to agree that an "out of the box" build would benefit from the DTT and SERT since both offer a plethora of tuning capabilities. As always, thanks for the informative reply.[sm=smiley20.gif]
I think it's suffice to say that whatever the user is comfortable with in the Autotune arena is as important as choosing a fuel management system that is to be tuned by a dynotuner according the THEIR familiarity. Simply put, buy what you are most comfortable with tweaking by either you or your dynotuner.
I'm an idiot and the TMax seemed idiot proof.
I only know that it has changed the characteristic of my bike for the better for a plug and play module hence the direction I took with my initial reply. Definitely not attempting to have a pissing contest on which tuner is the best. I'd be the first to agree that an "out of the box" build would benefit from the DTT and SERT since both offer a plethora of tuning capabilities. As always, thanks for the informative reply.[sm=smiley20.gif]
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Dec 2006
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From: Po-Dunk Looziana
RE: Daytona tuner...
ORIGINAL: PhilM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but Alpha-N & Speed Density are fuel delivery technologies.
It has nothing to do with timing control. In the DTT, timing is adjustable by RPM/MAP, not "just RPM".
Correct me if I'm wrong, but Alpha-N & Speed Density are fuel delivery technologies.
It has nothing to do with timing control. In the DTT, timing is adjustable by RPM/MAP, not "just RPM".
Iwasunder the impressionthat the MAP was just one of many sensors, as is the CKP, TP, and IAT sensors used by the ECM to calculate how much oxygen is entering the engine to achieve desired AFR and Spark sending this info to the front and rear ignition coils to deliver the desired timing of the spark for each cylinder.
I also thought that Alpha N and Speed Density were two different EFI technologies not used interchangably......ie.. EFI systems that sense engine load by the use of the throttle or TPS (throttle position sensor) are referred to as an Alpha-N system. EFI systems that sense engine load by the use of a MAP sensor are referred to as a Speed-Density system. I had no idea that timing could be set by just RPM..[&:]
Somebody clear the air on how these two determine timing please![&:]
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2006
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From: TX
RE: Daytona tuner...
ORIGINAL: UltraKla$$ic
I also thought that Alpha N and Speed Density were two different EFI technologies not used interchangably......ie.. EFI systems that sense engine load by the use of the throttle or TPS (throttle position sensor) are referred to as an Alpha-N system. EFI systems that sense engine load by the use of a MAP sensor are referred to as a Speed-Density system.
Somebody clear the air on how these two determine timing please![&:]
I also thought that Alpha N and Speed Density were two different EFI technologies not used interchangably......ie.. EFI systems that sense engine load by the use of the throttle or TPS (throttle position sensor) are referred to as an Alpha-N system. EFI systems that sense engine load by the use of a MAP sensor are referred to as a Speed-Density system.
Somebody clear the air on how these two determine timing please![&:]
With respect to where timing comes in.... think of it like this: On pre-EFI engines, you had a carb for fuel delivery and an ignition system (be it a distributor, a CDI, black box, MSD, Crane, whatever). Those are two disctinctly different systems.
In an EFI style engine, the TB replaces much of the functionality of the carb, but there are a few more things that go along with it (injectors, sensors, control code to mak eit all work, etc). That still does not bring ignition into the mix yet.
On our later model HD's, the ECM (Delphi, TMax, DTT, etc) has the brains to run the "control code" that manages and runs the fuel delivery system (Speed Density or Alpha-N). In that same physical housing is the ignition controller. THey are in the same box, but they are not the same. Ignition control on our bikes is quite crude compared to the technology that is in all the cars we drive. Our ignition timinig (when the plugs fire) is controller by means STATIC table(s). There is no input or control from any sort of "knock sensor" . Some of the systems we have today allow for more granular tuning than others, but all are static. Some may vary by MAP sensor readings, but the valuers are pre-set ~ hard coded.
One of the key things to tuning is "giving the engine what it want's (Right Kevin?). The challenge is understanding what it is telling you it "wants".
As these systems continue to evolve, we will see much better functionality like dynamic timing, knock detection, etc....
For now, we got what we got....
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Joined: Jul 2007
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From: Indy area
RE: Daytona tuner...
No knock sensor per se, but the Delphi unit senses too much advance back through the spark plug and coil, then backs off when present (certainly, to a limited degree!).
Thread Starter
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Road Warrior
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,571
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From: Houston Texas
RE: Daytona tuner...
Thanks PhilM and I think I'll wait for things to evolve... I was under the impression the DTT system was a complete control
system like what is found in vehicles today, I should have known on an air cooled system without any coolant "bladder" a Knock Sensor would go crazy... I think I just go with a SERT and AC and TD's and a good dyno tune for now... I really only have one
complaint and it's the heat... as far a power and torque, the SG has enough for me stock...
Your knowledge and guidance is greatly appriceated...
system like what is found in vehicles today, I should have known on an air cooled system without any coolant "bladder" a Knock Sensor would go crazy... I think I just go with a SERT and AC and TD's and a good dyno tune for now... I really only have one
complaint and it's the heat... as far a power and torque, the SG has enough for me stock...
Your knowledge and guidance is greatly appriceated...
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RE: Daytona tuner...
i like my DTT...it tuned my bike better than the previous SERT tuners could in our area...i have since turned OFF the autotune feature and the bike is very well mannered with lots of power....unless you have a good SERT tuner, get the DTT or TMax and be dollars ahead
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Joined: Dec 2006
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From: Po-Dunk Looziana
RE: Daytona tuner...
ORIGINAL: Bryan TTM
i like my DTT...it tuned my bike better than the previous SERT tuners could in our area...i have since turned OFF the autotune feature and the bike is very well mannered with lots of power....unless you have a good SERT tuner, get the DTT or TMax and be dollars ahead
i like my DTT...it tuned my bike better than the previous SERT tuners could in our area...i have since turned OFF the autotune feature and the bike is very well mannered with lots of power....unless you have a good SERT tuner, get the DTT or TMax and be dollars ahead
. Something to think about.