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So, I picked Pro-Action for the front. Earlier this week I went through the replacement - did it on my own, my very fist such job on a motorcycle. On the other hand - the Pro-Action front suspension is not much different than the HD's stock... in terms of components - almost identical dampener rod (with some shaved off sides), shorter but stiffer spring, and plastic spacer (oem is metal). Roughly $500 including oil. I can't wait to see how it performs, but I'm on a budged so can't complain. It's just that, $500 really, for roughly the same components?
Meanwhile, and kind of late, I realized that Legend Suspensions will "modify" your existing shock or fork kit to your specifications for moderate fees, plus shipping back and forth. Who knew? If I did, I would've sent both front rear and front "stuff" to get it modified to stock length/height. Now, I will send the rear shocks only and have them redone back to 13".
So I'll end up with Pro-Action in the front, and Legends in the back. /Spare front Legend kit too/
Question: With the bike lifted on a jack, can I take both rear shocks off? Would the rear wheel swing down or would the top/seat/fender collapse on to the tire?
Thats why theyre much less expensive, plus they didnt try to reinvent the wheel.
So, with Harley there is nothing wrong with the damper rod system. The theory is solid. The malfunction lies within the manufacturers design
We have designed and machined new damper rods out of billet steel. The new rods have completely different flow characteristics than the standard rods. We have replaced the stock spring rates with springs in may cases nearly twice the standard rate. The oil level and weight of oil have been modified to accommodate the new flow characteristics. The finished product is a fork that doesn't sag, greatly resists bottoming, rips high speed turns with confidence, but yet in all areas there is a much softer and smoother feel than stock. Low speed, mid range, and high speed bump reaction is nothing short of amazing. We have created a system where the damper rods, springs, spring pre-load, oil level, and oil weight have come together to provide a front end that does it all for just $375.00.
Thats why theyre much less expensive, plus they didnt try to reinvent the wheel.
So, with Harley there is nothing wrong with the damper rod system. The theory is solid. The malfunction lies within the manufacturers design
If all it is, is firmer spring and thicker oil yeah I can see how that can make some difference but the rods are not that different so thicker oil is what I'd suspect may make the biggest difference. I think that has been brought up here before.
I've fiddled with mountain bike suspension for over a decade now. I can say that the design of the HD fork is simpler than what I've seen (Fox, Manitou, Marzocchi). Additional bushings and better piston/rod ring imo could've made huge difference.... Anyway.
I haven't done much research, but I'm surprised there isn't much chatter here about Fox suspension, especially front. To me they are the leader overall.
If all it is, is firmer spring and thicker oil yeah I can see how that can make some difference but the rods are not that different so thicker oil is what I'd suspect may make the biggest difference. I think that has been brought up here before.
I've fiddled with mountain bike suspension for over a decade now. I can say that the design of the HD fork is simpler than what I've seen (Fox, Manitou, Marzocchi). Additional bushings and better piston/rod ring imo could've made huge difference.... Anyway.
I haven't done much research, but I'm surprised there isn't much chatter here about Fox suspension, especially front. To me they are the leader overall.
If you do a side by side comparison of a stock rod vs a Pro Action rod you'll see that there are subtle differences, but that's enough to make them way better. I had Fox fronts in my SGS, and moved to Pro Action last June after a cross country trip. Hands down, the Pro Action is better than the Fox. They are firm, but not harsh like the Fox's were. As an aside, I swapped the rear Fox's out for Pro Action at the same time. Again, they are way better.
If you do a side by side comparison of a stock rod vs a Pro Action rod you'll see that there are subtle differences, but that's enough to make them way better. I had Fox fronts in my SGS, and moved to Pro Action last June after a cross country trip. Hands down, the Pro Action is better than the Fox. They are firm, but not harsh like the Fox's were. As an aside, I swapped the rear Fox's out for Pro Action at the same time. Again, they are way better.
Yeah, I pretty much took your recommendation, did some research on my own and decided to go with Pro-Action in the front. If Legend can bring back the rear shocks to stock height, I'd give them a try.
Road king with air forks and shocks.
Factory oil in forks is 10w, rear shocks is 7 weight.
Change fork fluid to 15w at oem amount per fork (different amounts between just oil change,and more for rebuild where you have them apart and removing all the old oil),
Change rear shock fluid to 10w at 10.5oz per shock (once you have all the old fluid drained out)
and Bobs you uncle for a bike that is not longer marshmallow'g pogo'g in the corners, or down the straights with lack of road feel as well, and your done for less than $26 in fluids Plus have enough fluid to do it again at 30K when you should be changing the fluids in the forks and the shocks..
Note, I tend to just rebuild the forks at 30K, to really get all the old fork oil out and replace the bushings/seals, since the fluid looks like this is 30k, from the teflon coating that is worn off the bushings in the first place. On the shocks, not so much as dark, but since easy enough to change the fluid as well, they get new fluid at the same time.
Simply, start here, and if feel that you need to up the ante with new shock and inserts for a grand or more that maybe you can feel a sight better difference on the "Drunk lumbering Ox" of a straight line sled that the HD touring bikes really are with all the weight, then can do so if you have the money to burn.
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Simply, start here, and if feel that you need to up the ante with new shock and inserts for a grand or more that maybe you can feel a sight better difference on the "Drunk lumbering Ox" of a straight line sled that the HD touring bikes really are with all the weight, then can do so if you have the money to burn.
I already installed the PA fork setup and have sent the rear shocks back to Legend for conversation to 13", but I would have done what you suggested. I can't fathom why the previous owner spent $3,500 on a suspension that I'm now undoing.
Yeah as I mentioned earlier, I believe the biggest differentiator in the Pro-Action fork setup is the thicker oil, but I haven't tested it yet.
Color of the used fluid, really comes down to the color of the bushing teflon coating in the end.
Being that the used fluid in your case is more of a bronze, then that means that the Tefon coating on those bushing are more of a bronze color, then black coating color instead.
And to point out, cartridges that use less fluid, but still have Teflon bushing, just means that less fluid that the coating as it wears, is going to saturate faster, meaning more frequent fluid changes, and in cartridge systems, ones that you can not service yourself.
So back to Harley air ride forks, and if you are going to service the forks yourself, and looking for a next improvement over just the fluid swap, the Race tech gold Vavles are not a bad way to go to add a touch more dial in, since still using the same amount of fork oil, it captured on top of the dampening rod via the spring, and no more harder to rebuild the forks, that if not in play as well. https://racetech.com/gold-valves/
As for rear air ride shocks,the world is your oyster to adjust the dampening over just fluid weight changes, since dampening wave washer stack is just too easy to adjust for a few dollars as well.
Note, in the above dampen stack, rubber bumper on shaft started to dissolve, to make the dampening too stiff due to the rubber blocking the passages ways. So nothing needed more than just unbolting the nut, to pull the stack one by one to spray clean with carb cleaner, then reassembly the stack and retighen the rod retainer bolt with some Red loctite.
So if doing fluid changes on the HD air shocks, and you are getting chunkies out with the old fluid, then may be time to pull the shocks apart, and spend the few dollars to just rebuild the shocks, even if they have not started to leak yet.
To add, was this the fluid from the forks outside of cartage void area that is used to keep the oem bushings lubed, or was this the oil from inside the cartridges that is used for dampening and internal cartridges lube?
I ask, since with even switching to cartridges in the forks, you still have to replace the oem fork bushings and seals, plus run the light amount of oil in each leg to keep the oem bushing lubed, and which they still wear at the normal about of wear that they should be replaced every 30K as well.
Simply, after market cartridges may come with life time warrenty, but does not mean they will not still need to be rebuilt/fluid changes from time to time, as well the oem bushings and seal and fluid used to keep them lubed, replaced ever 30K like normal a well.
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