Converting to a 6 speed
Road Captain
Joined: Sep 2006
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RE: Converting to a 6 speed
Baker and Jims have true OD gearsets for your application. Baker and S&S have Direct Drive 6 speeds (6th gear is 1:1). The overdrive on the Baker comes from changing the primary chain and sprocket. On the S&S you change the transmission pulley. These are in the $2000 range.
The foreign 6 speeds run 800-1000 for a gearset.
Installation is a bit more than just slide in... You'll need the tools to remove/install the trans shaft bearing. Also the maindrive gear and bearing. You can change the transmission coutershaft bearing without special tools....
The foreign 6 speeds run 800-1000 for a gearset.
Installation is a bit more than just slide in... You'll need the tools to remove/install the trans shaft bearing. Also the maindrive gear and bearing. You can change the transmission coutershaft bearing without special tools....
Thread Starter
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Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 2,782
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From: NC
RE: Converting to a 6 speed
ORIGINAL: Steelknee57
I don't think you will get improved gas mileage, if that is what you are looking for. I have the HD Se 6 speedcomplete transand I get the same mileage as my buddies do with their 5 speeds. 6th is really useless below 70mph.
What you do get is the sensation of doing 70mph at 80mph. For me, it just seemsmore relaxedat 80mph +with the 6 speed.
The cost was $3500.00 in 2005 for mine.
I don't think you will get improved gas mileage, if that is what you are looking for. I have the HD Se 6 speedcomplete transand I get the same mileage as my buddies do with their 5 speeds. 6th is really useless below 70mph.
What you do get is the sensation of doing 70mph at 80mph. For me, it just seemsmore relaxedat 80mph +with the 6 speed.
The cost was $3500.00 in 2005 for mine.
Banned
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,145
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From: St.Louis, MO.
RE: Converting to a 6 speed
Here's an alternative for ya....I put 18" wheels and Metzlers on my '06 SG...the 18" are just a tad taller than the original 16's...in effect changing the gear ratio a little bit....so not only does the scooter look waaaay better with 18's BUT I can also run 80 (in 5th) at about 3200 rpm's.....since these motors will run all day at 3500 rpm's are so....its all good
Just a thought
Just a thought
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 6,336
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From: SW Minnesota
RE: Converting to a 6 speed
But wouldn't mileage improve since rpms are less at highway speeds?
RPM's is only one element. You also have to consider the cam's and subsequent torque curve as to where the engine is running at its most efficient RPM.
Back in the late 70's, during the 55 mph national speed limit, I got much better mileage on trips by driving in fourth gear rather than 5th on a Yamaha XS750. On my XS 1100 and Venture 1200 I never used 5th unless I was running over 70 mph, or the engines would lug, gas mileage dropped, and pipe ends turned black.
There's a thread on here somewhere about the success some '07 and '08 riders have had raising theirmileage by changing engine sprockets and raising their cruising RPMs.
RPM's is only one element. You also have to consider the cam's and subsequent torque curve as to where the engine is running at its most efficient RPM.
Back in the late 70's, during the 55 mph national speed limit, I got much better mileage on trips by driving in fourth gear rather than 5th on a Yamaha XS750. On my XS 1100 and Venture 1200 I never used 5th unless I was running over 70 mph, or the engines would lug, gas mileage dropped, and pipe ends turned black.
There's a thread on here somewhere about the success some '07 and '08 riders have had raising theirmileage by changing engine sprockets and raising their cruising RPMs.
Tourer
Joined: Apr 2008
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From:
RE: Converting to a 6 speed
OK, now even I'm confused. Maybe I'm missing something here.
The 2006 and older 5 speeds have a final trans. ratio of 1 to 1 (direct drive)(5th)
The newer 2007 - up are 6 speeds with the final trans. ratio of 1 to 1 (direct drive)(6th)
The newer bikes have changed the primary ratios to allow 6th gear to reduce the engine rpms because the trans. in highest gear are the same.
If I change the primary ratios in my 2007 to increase rpms and get alittle quicker, the other 5 gears are also affected and will rap out sooner, 1st gear is then more of a granny gear and many I've talked to that did this can start off in 2nd gear.
SO, why would it be any different with the Baker direct drive?
From my research, the most efficient way is to go to a overdrive trans. and leave the primary alone. You can spec. the ratios of the first 5 gears to work better in an '07 bike. I would then have 5 speeds at the proper ratios and a true advantage in 6th.
Otherwise its the same as just changing the primary in a HD stock 6 speed.
BUT, ratios not withstanding, a direct drive will generally dyno at higher hp / torque than an overdrive. A direct drive usually has less parasitic loss because it is turning fewer gear sets.
What am I missing here?????
U
The 2006 and older 5 speeds have a final trans. ratio of 1 to 1 (direct drive)(5th)
The newer 2007 - up are 6 speeds with the final trans. ratio of 1 to 1 (direct drive)(6th)
The newer bikes have changed the primary ratios to allow 6th gear to reduce the engine rpms because the trans. in highest gear are the same.
If I change the primary ratios in my 2007 to increase rpms and get alittle quicker, the other 5 gears are also affected and will rap out sooner, 1st gear is then more of a granny gear and many I've talked to that did this can start off in 2nd gear.
SO, why would it be any different with the Baker direct drive?
From my research, the most efficient way is to go to a overdrive trans. and leave the primary alone. You can spec. the ratios of the first 5 gears to work better in an '07 bike. I would then have 5 speeds at the proper ratios and a true advantage in 6th.
Otherwise its the same as just changing the primary in a HD stock 6 speed.
BUT, ratios not withstanding, a direct drive will generally dyno at higher hp / torque than an overdrive. A direct drive usually has less parasitic loss because it is turning fewer gear sets.
What am I missing here?????
U
Banned
Joined: Mar 2006
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RE: Converting to a 6 speed
the standard 07 six speed is not a direct drive 1.1, its inferior to the ones i mentioned earlier and thats why there were so many complaints about them.... there are several ways to change ratios....engine sprocket/ring gear....countershaft/pulley....gears in tranny....the 3.37 will not render you a granny gear but you will feel the extra punch....itraised my rpms across the board by 200 rpms....combine that with a good OD tranny and you'll end up with a great setup for both around town punchin it and hiway cruizin...Bakers DD6 is the only true direct drive and its 1-5 ratios are different than all the others so they put a larger engine sprocket on which brings the ratios to a more rideable in all gear setup
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Road Captain
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 683
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From: Tallahassee, FL
RE: Converting to a 6 speed
So if you go to a 3:37 primary and a Baker DD6, Where are your RPMs at, say, 70 mph....are they the same as a 5 speed in 5th, or are they still lower by 200 or so?
Banned
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 8,603
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RE: Converting to a 6 speed
the DD6 uses a 28 tooth front pulley and its very close to the 3.37 mod done with a 24 tooth instead of the stock 25 tooth with SE or OD type tranny...at 70 its 2800 on my DD6...however i also run the 37 tooth ring gear on the clutch.....if you run a 24 tooth up front on a DD6 you will have a granny gear setup....IMO there are two real nice ways to do a 6sp.....either the DD6 w 28/37 or the SE w 24 tooth....both are so close to each other its really a matter of preference....now this is on 06 and earlier bikes as the 07's up have a slightly different setup with their stock 6sp
at 70 i'm 2600 in 6th
70 is 2800
i use the 6th lots even at 60mph
at 70 i'm 2600 in 6th
70 is 2800
i use the 6th lots even at 60mph