Local HD dealer laying off
Road Master
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 938
Likes: 0
From: North Central Arkansas
Here's what I'm thinking--there are quite a few dealers out there who have no business being IN business. The ones I'm talking about don't know beans about customer service and thought "HD" stood for "Hot Damn!" and they had hopped aboard a gravy train that would never end. As the old saying goes, "a rising tide lifts all boats" and when there were waiting lists for new bikes these guys could get away with murder. But now the coin has flipped and you've got to be a savvy business person just to survive. As far as I'm concerned, some of these characters can go straight out of business without passing "go" and without collecting $200. I went a lot of years without a dealership within 100 miles and I can do it again. I may have to travel farther but at least I'll know that they probably care about my business.
Again, Milwaukee uses the excuse that they're all independents dealers out there, but I think they've been sitting up on Olympus fat, dumb, and happy for some time now, and just like the big auto makers, sometimes you gotta get slapped down pretty hard before you learn your lesson. It's time for the MOCO to go pay the dealers periodic visits and slap them down before the downturn does it for them.
The fact of the matter is, these sucky dealers were sucky before the economic downturn.
Road Master
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,231
Likes: 0
From: FLORIDA
American's have had the "buy for less than MSRP" drilled in us for years and years, due to the auto industry. I don't have a problem paying MSRP, if that is what it costs, but as soon as the "big discounts" start, everyone wants to see how much they can get "off" on their purchase.
I also want the best deal that I can get, but if I go into a dealer and the product that I want is MSRP, and I can afford it without feeling that I am being ripped off, I'll buy it.
That being said, If I go into a dealer and pay MSRP and "ole' Joe" goes in a week later and tells me that he got his ride for $1k less than MSRP.. I'm gonna be ticked off.
Guess what I'm saying is, if you sell at MSRP, stay there. If you are going to "deal" and come off, set a standard amount off. (read: 10% off MSRP,etc.)
I paid a little less than MSRP when I bought my bike, not much... but had a few freebies thrown in, nothing major. Do I feel ripped off? No, I paid what I considered a fair price. Could I have gotten it for less, possibly... but where would I have had to gone to buy it.
In my opinion, it would be best that Harley (MOCO) took control and sold their bikes MSRP. If a dealer wants to "throw" stuff in to intice you to purchase from their dealership.... let them do that.
Just my opinion....
I also want the best deal that I can get, but if I go into a dealer and the product that I want is MSRP, and I can afford it without feeling that I am being ripped off, I'll buy it.
That being said, If I go into a dealer and pay MSRP and "ole' Joe" goes in a week later and tells me that he got his ride for $1k less than MSRP.. I'm gonna be ticked off.
Guess what I'm saying is, if you sell at MSRP, stay there. If you are going to "deal" and come off, set a standard amount off. (read: 10% off MSRP,etc.)
I paid a little less than MSRP when I bought my bike, not much... but had a few freebies thrown in, nothing major. Do I feel ripped off? No, I paid what I considered a fair price. Could I have gotten it for less, possibly... but where would I have had to gone to buy it.
In my opinion, it would be best that Harley (MOCO) took control and sold their bikes MSRP. If a dealer wants to "throw" stuff in to intice you to purchase from their dealership.... let them do that.
Just my opinion....
I totally agree with you and I would also pay the MSRP but the problem is that they (dealers) are not consistent. Right now it is all over the place and my local dealer doesn't want to deal at all. These clowns still want an extra $1100 in BS fees and it just pisses me off b/c I would like to buy local and help support my local dealer but I can't when they are not even being reasonable.
I have gotten quotes on SG from numerous dealers the past few months and there is differences as much as 3K OTD that is ludicrous.
I just refuse to pay the fluff fees above MSRP. My other problem is that the best price I got so far is 13hrs away but I may end up there
Club Member
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,003
Likes: 69
From: Granite Falls, NC
Yep, the HD dealer in my area has layed some of its workers off, lessened the amount of hours the store is open, and is now closed on Mondays. Unemployment here is above 8%, things are not good.
Road Captain
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 630
Likes: 0
From: East Coast of FL
We had 2 dealers here, both owned by the same people, about 20 miles apart. The smaller of the two shops closed the doors, and they are consolidating with the other store. I guess it's a sign of the economy.
Road Master
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 803
Likes: 0
From: Northern, NJ
My original deposit was on a FLTR at NewRoc HD in New Rochelle, NY. They were offering to pay ALL sales tax (8% in NY)
When I realized how close Bergen HD was to my new home (NJ), I just had to go over there and check out their deals. Low & behold they beat the NRHD price with their 11% off MSRP sale.
NRHD was ready willing and able to beat Bergen's deal, but I chose to stay close to home and deal with Bergen.
Last edited by shredsurf; Jan 13, 2009 at 05:52 PM. Reason: cause people SUCK!
Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 142
Likes: 1
From: SE Wisconsin
They will deal!
First of all, I am the proud and extremely happy owner of a new 2009 FLTR!!!
Here's the story.
I did what I said I was going to do -- I went to three dealers, all within a 30 minute drive of my home. Two of them are big dealers (large facilities). The third is a very small dealer. All of them have been around for many years. I told each of them I was going to buy a bike today, and asked them to give me their best deal price.
I went to the small dealer first. I was there for nearly two hours (didn't expect that). When they finally got around to giving me a price, they wrote down MSRP plus Freight and Prep! I was a bit surprised, and asked if they understood that I was asking for their best deal. They basically told me that they could do better, but didn't want to commit until they knew where the other guys were at, and would then beat their price. I told him that wasn't my intent, to get other prices and come back. He wanted to know what I thought was a "fair" price, and although I had one in mind, I didn't answer. So, I thanked him for the quote and moved on.
The second two dealers were the big guys. At the first one I dealt with the sales manager. I told him what I was doing, and he answered straight away, you can have the bike for $2,000 under MSRP plus freight and prep (about $900). He said that was his best deal, and if the third dealer wouldn't do better, he looked forward to selling me a bike.
The third dealer was my best deal, by about $150. Again, unlike the small dealer, they gave me an out-the-door price within 10 minutes. The deal basically amounted to $1,250 below sticker, no freight and no prep charges. The total out-the-door (including taxes/title/etc) was just shy of $19,800.00. The price I was looking for, OTD, was $20,250.00 -- so I'm glad I didn't tell that to the first dealer.
So, a couple things I learned. The dealers in my area will sell a bike for under MSRP. Smaller dealers with less apparent overhead, aren't necessarily the ones that will deliver the best deal.
The only downside of this -- I live in SE Wisconsin, where the roads are covered in salt, so the bike will be sitting in my garage for 2 - 3 months before I can get out and ride it!
Here's the story.
I did what I said I was going to do -- I went to three dealers, all within a 30 minute drive of my home. Two of them are big dealers (large facilities). The third is a very small dealer. All of them have been around for many years. I told each of them I was going to buy a bike today, and asked them to give me their best deal price.
I went to the small dealer first. I was there for nearly two hours (didn't expect that). When they finally got around to giving me a price, they wrote down MSRP plus Freight and Prep! I was a bit surprised, and asked if they understood that I was asking for their best deal. They basically told me that they could do better, but didn't want to commit until they knew where the other guys were at, and would then beat their price. I told him that wasn't my intent, to get other prices and come back. He wanted to know what I thought was a "fair" price, and although I had one in mind, I didn't answer. So, I thanked him for the quote and moved on.
The second two dealers were the big guys. At the first one I dealt with the sales manager. I told him what I was doing, and he answered straight away, you can have the bike for $2,000 under MSRP plus freight and prep (about $900). He said that was his best deal, and if the third dealer wouldn't do better, he looked forward to selling me a bike.
The third dealer was my best deal, by about $150. Again, unlike the small dealer, they gave me an out-the-door price within 10 minutes. The deal basically amounted to $1,250 below sticker, no freight and no prep charges. The total out-the-door (including taxes/title/etc) was just shy of $19,800.00. The price I was looking for, OTD, was $20,250.00 -- so I'm glad I didn't tell that to the first dealer.
So, a couple things I learned. The dealers in my area will sell a bike for under MSRP. Smaller dealers with less apparent overhead, aren't necessarily the ones that will deliver the best deal.
The only downside of this -- I live in SE Wisconsin, where the roads are covered in salt, so the bike will be sitting in my garage for 2 - 3 months before I can get out and ride it!
Stage I
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
I agree with hotshop. Pay MSRP and stick to it...period.
Went to "my" dealer today cash in hand to trade my 08 SG for the 09 SG just because I can't live with out it. MSRP but.... squat for 08 (15,000) a 4k+ loss in one year.
I've bought 5 bikes in 7 years all for cash and carry some clout at dealer. Dealer is in good shape sold more in 08 than 07 but has 140 new bikes in stock now many good used bikes out front.
He said the auctions have tons of bikes selling way too cheap. His thoughts were the market is flooded right now (repos) and told me to wait till march and hope for an increase in sales and maybe he could do a better deal.
I DID APPRECIATE HIS TRYING TO HELP, HIS SITUATION AND THE HONEST REPLY AS I HAVE A SMALL BUSINESS TOO.
My thoughts: Drop the darm interest to market value, come off MSRP $1K, and don't sell to those "posers" with poor credit. The harley party is over, the public harley clothes FADE is gone, trades in suck and outright sale to JQ public is going away becauase they can't finance it.
I'M GOING TO RIDE MINE! I'M NOT HOPEING FOR A DEAL RATHER I'M HOPEING MY LOCAL CAN HANG IN THERE AND MAKE MONEY AND SUPPORT THE COMMUNITY.
NOW HD INC CAN STAND A LITTLE AWAKENING.
Went to "my" dealer today cash in hand to trade my 08 SG for the 09 SG just because I can't live with out it. MSRP but.... squat for 08 (15,000) a 4k+ loss in one year.
I've bought 5 bikes in 7 years all for cash and carry some clout at dealer. Dealer is in good shape sold more in 08 than 07 but has 140 new bikes in stock now many good used bikes out front.
He said the auctions have tons of bikes selling way too cheap. His thoughts were the market is flooded right now (repos) and told me to wait till march and hope for an increase in sales and maybe he could do a better deal.
I DID APPRECIATE HIS TRYING TO HELP, HIS SITUATION AND THE HONEST REPLY AS I HAVE A SMALL BUSINESS TOO.
My thoughts: Drop the darm interest to market value, come off MSRP $1K, and don't sell to those "posers" with poor credit. The harley party is over, the public harley clothes FADE is gone, trades in suck and outright sale to JQ public is going away becauase they can't finance it.
I'M GOING TO RIDE MINE! I'M NOT HOPEING FOR A DEAL RATHER I'M HOPEING MY LOCAL CAN HANG IN THERE AND MAKE MONEY AND SUPPORT THE COMMUNITY.
NOW HD INC CAN STAND A LITTLE AWAKENING.
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Road Master
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,231
Likes: 0
From: FLORIDA
First of all, I am the proud and extremely happy owner of a new 2009 FLTR!!!
Here's the story.
I did what I said I was going to do -- I went to three dealers, all within a 30 minute drive of my home. Two of them are big dealers (large facilities). The third is a very small dealer. All of them have been around for many years. I told each of them I was going to buy a bike today, and asked them to give me their best deal price.
I went to the small dealer first. I was there for nearly two hours (didn't expect that). When they finally got around to giving me a price, they wrote down MSRP plus Freight and Prep! I was a bit surprised, and asked if they understood that I was asking for their best deal. They basically told me that they could do better, but didn't want to commit until they knew where the other guys were at, and would then beat their price. I told him that wasn't my intent, to get other prices and come back. He wanted to know what I thought was a "fair" price, and although I had one in mind, I didn't answer. So, I thanked him for the quote and moved on.
The second two dealers were the big guys. At the first one I dealt with the sales manager. I told him what I was doing, and he answered straight away, you can have the bike for $2,000 under MSRP plus freight and prep (about $900). He said that was his best deal, and if the third dealer wouldn't do better, he looked forward to selling me a bike.
The third dealer was my best deal, by about $150. Again, unlike the small dealer, they gave me an out-the-door price within 10 minutes. The deal basically amounted to $1,250 below sticker, no freight and no prep charges. The total out-the-door (including taxes/title/etc) was just shy of $19,800.00. The price I was looking for, OTD, was $20,250.00 -- so I'm glad I didn't tell that to the first dealer.
So, a couple things I learned. The dealers in my area will sell a bike for under MSRP. Smaller dealers with less apparent overhead, aren't necessarily the ones that will deliver the best deal.
The only downside of this -- I live in SE Wisconsin, where the roads are covered in salt, so the bike will be sitting in my garage for 2 - 3 months before I can get out and ride it!
Here's the story.
I did what I said I was going to do -- I went to three dealers, all within a 30 minute drive of my home. Two of them are big dealers (large facilities). The third is a very small dealer. All of them have been around for many years. I told each of them I was going to buy a bike today, and asked them to give me their best deal price.
I went to the small dealer first. I was there for nearly two hours (didn't expect that). When they finally got around to giving me a price, they wrote down MSRP plus Freight and Prep! I was a bit surprised, and asked if they understood that I was asking for their best deal. They basically told me that they could do better, but didn't want to commit until they knew where the other guys were at, and would then beat their price. I told him that wasn't my intent, to get other prices and come back. He wanted to know what I thought was a "fair" price, and although I had one in mind, I didn't answer. So, I thanked him for the quote and moved on.
The second two dealers were the big guys. At the first one I dealt with the sales manager. I told him what I was doing, and he answered straight away, you can have the bike for $2,000 under MSRP plus freight and prep (about $900). He said that was his best deal, and if the third dealer wouldn't do better, he looked forward to selling me a bike.
The third dealer was my best deal, by about $150. Again, unlike the small dealer, they gave me an out-the-door price within 10 minutes. The deal basically amounted to $1,250 below sticker, no freight and no prep charges. The total out-the-door (including taxes/title/etc) was just shy of $19,800.00. The price I was looking for, OTD, was $20,250.00 -- so I'm glad I didn't tell that to the first dealer.
So, a couple things I learned. The dealers in my area will sell a bike for under MSRP. Smaller dealers with less apparent overhead, aren't necessarily the ones that will deliver the best deal.
The only downside of this -- I live in SE Wisconsin, where the roads are covered in salt, so the bike will be sitting in my garage for 2 - 3 months before I can get out and ride it!
Congrats!!!
Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 142
Likes: 1
From: SE Wisconsin
Interesting turn of events. The small dealer called me at home, was curious what the other dealers said. I told him I signed the papers and shared with him the OTD price. He congratulated me on getting a good deal. Ten minutes later he calls back -- his boss wants to counter the offer, taking off another $400, for a total of $19,400 OTD (this is about $2,000 under MSRP, with no prep fees). I told him I appreciated the effort, but I already signed a deal and was going to stick with it. Had he made this offer earlier in the day, when I asked for their best deal, he would have had the sale. Anyway, this again shows that dealers, both large and small, can and will deal.