Engine Ping

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Apr 7, 2009 | 03:56 PM

#11

Gearhead3

Road Captain

Joined: Jan 2009

Posts: 739

Likes: 2

From: St. Louis

Quote:

Originally Posted by Petesnot

Pinging is pre-ignition and can really f*#$ up you motor.

Sorry, but pinging (detonation) and pre-ignition are two seperate entities, similar but not the same.

Detonation is the spontaneous combustion of the end-gas (remaining fuel/air mixture) in the chamber. It always occurs after normal combustion is initiated by the spark plug. The initial combustion at the spark plug is followed by a normal combustion burn. For some reason, likely heat and pressure, the end gas in the chamber spontaneously combusts. The key point here is that detonation occurs after you have initiated the normal combustion with the spark plug.

Pre-ignition is defined as the ignition of the mixture prior to the spark plug firing. Anytime something causes the mixture in the chamber to ignite prior to the spark plug event it is classified as pre-ignition. The two are completely different and abnormal phenomenon.

Apr 7, 2009 | 05:47 PM

#12

SpiderPig

Stellar HDF Member

Joined: Jan 2008

Posts: 3,036

Likes: 65

From: Earth

Quote:

Sorry, but pinging (detonation) and pre-ignition are two seperate entities, similar but not the same.

So, do these two conditions sound different to the ear? How do you know which one is which?? I have the same senerio in 5th and only when you twist hard I get the ping ping a few times.

Apr 7, 2009 | 06:22 PM

#13

bigdumbnoitall00

Seasoned HDF Member

Joined: Dec 2007

Posts: 8,341

Likes: 714

u can a nd should run 5th gear with no problems at 70 i never get to 6th till im at 75 or better the motor does not make enough power at 2400 rpm to pull that tall of a gear
used to run my 05 at 85 all day 3500 rpm and never a problem

Apr 7, 2009 | 06:22 PM

#14

bigdumbnoitall00

Seasoned HDF Member

Joined: Dec 2007

Posts: 8,341

Likes: 714

also look at some thundermax threads on this as it may be a timing issue.

Apr 8, 2009 | 04:57 AM

#15

kingkingking

Road Warrior

Joined: Dec 2008

Posts: 1,639

Likes: 2

From: Australia

Detonation has a deeper knock to it, pinging is a higher pitch.

Pinging is caused by a combination of ignition timing, octane and mixture. A lean mixture takes longer to get burning. Thats why the ignition is advanced at part throttle when cruising (lean mixture) and retarded when the throttle is opened (rich mixture to make power).

When it was stock my king would ping at full throttle when below 3000rpm on 95 grade petrol, it was intolerable with 89. I had to run 98 in it to get it to stop. I dont think you guys in the US even have 98. My bike is HDI, i think it runs a different tune to the US bikes.

Bottom line is the computer is running the motor real lean at part throttle for better economy and better emmissions. Get the computer to throw a little more fuel in.

Apr 8, 2009 | 05:45 AM

#16

roadking1893

Thread Starter

Tourer

Joined: May 2008

Posts: 460

Likes: 0

From: Southern Maryland

I guess me being new to the V-Twin world I am not all that familiar about high rpm to maintain a certain speed. Thank you for the detailed summary on the difference of the two I've come to accept I will be riding 5th gear ata a high rpm a great deal.

Apr 8, 2009 | 06:14 AM

#17

kingkingking

Road Warrior

Joined: Dec 2008

Posts: 1,639

Likes: 2

From: Australia

I am straight into 6th at 55 when cruising, i wouldnt cruise at 70 in 5th on the freeway if I was you (worse fuel economy and more wear). Thats just me. Run higher octane or retune and add fuel imho. These bikes are a tractor and should pull from 1500 in 6th if tuned right. The TC96 has a 4 3/8 stroke - thats longer than a 454 chev. There shouldnt be any need to wring its neck if it is tuned right.

Apr 8, 2009 | 09:17 AM

#18

poppa cooter

Tourer

Joined: Aug 2007

Posts: 466

Likes: 0

Quote:

Originally Posted by roadking1893

It was a perfect day for a ride so I decided to head west to Hagerstown which meant some highway and 70+ mph. The only thing I experienced was what I believe was an "engine ping" when I get into 6th gear around 70mph and the engine feels like it is lagging. but when I down shift back to 5th engine sound smooth and the throttle response is great, now in order to maintain 65mph I am high on the rpm around 2500-3000 more toward 3K.

Is it posible to experienced pinging at that speed? what harm am I inducing riding at such high rpm? I almost have to be around 75+ in order to kick it in 6th gear. Is this normal with the 6th gear with several minor MODs on the bike: true dual, custom mufflers, Zipper hi-flow air cleaner and thunder max with auto tune.

i also have a thundermax and ther is a couple of things you may need to investigate..... first is your map most of these canned maps are for a 2.75 air filter, and guess what i measured my se ac and it is 2.25 that meens i have to use a map with 2.25 air filter or the air to fuel ratio is not calibrated...... also the timing under timing vs engine speed is set high in the upper rpm i adjusted mine down 4 deg to get rid of the scissor sound under my gas tank. or you may want to buy a 2.75 air filter if yours is 2.25 cuz like i said your air to fuel calibration may be off if this is the case then clear all your learned fuel adjustments so it can re-learn. i hope this helps.