Stage 1 Kit for FLHTK
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Cruiser
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 125
Likes: 1
From: Tucson, AZ
Stage 1 Kit for FLHTK
Will be taking delivery of a 2010 FLHTK right before Xmas. I have gotten different stories form different dealers on whether or not put Stage 1 kit on the new bike. I am not looking for more HP, as I'm told the stock is pretty good, but i am looking for better sound. Here in lies the question: some dealers say I can swap out the existing mufflers with a SE, street-legal version without mods to airflow and new timing downloads. Others say I need to do it all or bike will suffer in terms of performance. Naturally, they have a "winter" special on service to do this, so I'm suspect. Any ideas out there? Thanks in advance for your help and advice.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 11,463
Likes: 2,990
From: Charleston, SC
Put a slipon of your choice on. Thats all you need to do.
I used fuelmoto's PowerTube. Excellent pipe with a great sound at idle and at speed.
250-ish shipped. I like it better than the D&D Fatcat's I've been using too.
Performance...whole nother subject. Most would say to change out the Air Cleaner, get a fuel management device, a performance exhaust, and then do a Dyno run or three. Or get autotune, or Download, or ..., or .... But thats just most. Hundreds of different ways and combinations to do "performance".
But as I said, if you are just looking for sound...get a slipon and call it a day. You don't need a download or "stage 1" to do sound.
Good Luck.
lp
I used fuelmoto's PowerTube. Excellent pipe with a great sound at idle and at speed.
250-ish shipped. I like it better than the D&D Fatcat's I've been using too.
Performance...whole nother subject. Most would say to change out the Air Cleaner, get a fuel management device, a performance exhaust, and then do a Dyno run or three. Or get autotune, or Download, or ..., or .... But thats just most. Hundreds of different ways and combinations to do "performance".
But as I said, if you are just looking for sound...get a slipon and call it a day. You don't need a download or "stage 1" to do sound.
Good Luck.
lp
Road Master
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,066
Likes: 9
From: Duluth, GA
Ummm....errr...ahhhmmmm, well I don't know that I would go so far as to say just put on the slip-on of your choice and let it go at that. Depending on what you put on, the ECM will need to be re-mapped. Dealers can put a generic map on the bike...but I don't know the effectiveness of that to be honest. Don't get me wrong...there are some slip-ons out there that advertise that no remapping is involved...while others will tell you upfront that if you bike is stock...the ECM requires a re-map. It would be worth your time to research.
I caught my dealer running a special...I already had put on new slip-ons, and the vendor (Klock Werks) did state that the ECM needed remapping if my bike was stock. I had a Screaming Eagle Hi-Flow air cleaner, Race Tuner and dyno done for 750 out the door.
I caught my dealer running a special...I already had put on new slip-ons, and the vendor (Klock Werks) did state that the ECM needed remapping if my bike was stock. I had a Screaming Eagle Hi-Flow air cleaner, Race Tuner and dyno done for 750 out the door.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 11,463
Likes: 2,990
From: Charleston, SC
Ummm....errr...ahhhmmmm, well I don't know that I would go so far as to say just put on the slip-on of your choice and let it go at that. Depending on what you put on, the ECM will need to be re-mapped. Dealers can put a generic map on the bike...but I don't know the effectiveness of that to be honest. Don't get me wrong...there are some slip-ons out there that advertise that no remapping is involved...while others will tell you upfront that if you bike is stock...the ECM requires a re-map. It would be worth your time to research.
I caught my dealer running a special...I already had put on new slip-ons, and the vendor (Klock Werks) did state that the ECM needed remapping if my bike was stock. I had a Screaming Eagle Hi-Flow air cleaner, Race Tuner and dyno done for 750 out the door.
I caught my dealer running a special...I already had put on new slip-ons, and the vendor (Klock Werks) did state that the ECM needed remapping if my bike was stock. I had a Screaming Eagle Hi-Flow air cleaner, Race Tuner and dyno done for 750 out the door.
The point is the newer ECM with O2s will adjust for small changes. Slipons are considered a small change as it does NOT change the fuel mixture or amount of air (typically) entering the engine - for the most part. That said, the ECM will try to keep the mix at a decidedly Lean(stock) mixture which leads to heat and possibly faster wear and tear down the road.
Point is slipons are easy and no matter what the Dealer is telling you...they don't have a "map" download that matches every slipon and air cleaner combination out there unless you're using stock Harley parts. So a download is pretty much a waste of money if you're using aftermarket parts - not that it won't help.
Anyhow, better to get a full blown management device if you plan to do more than slipons but as stated, many are running without, even with an A/C...
But please...don't take my word for it. Read all I have stated above in about 10 different Harley mags, and only 10,000 threads on this site alone...
Having done the research myself for the last 4 years it basically comes down to this: What are you comfortable with? DO it.
lp
Last edited by lp; Dec 13, 2009 at 10:38 AM.
Road Master
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,066
Likes: 9
From: Duluth, GA
If you don't modify the Air Cleaner you do not need to remap. In fact some manufacturers like D&D state you can actually DO the A/C and their fatcat without any download and remap which is very surprising.
The point is the newer ECM with O2s will adjust for small changes. Slipons are considered a small change as it does NOT change the fuel mixture or amount of air (typically) entering the engine - for the most part. That said, the ECM will try to keep the mix at a decidedly Lean(stock) mixture which leads to heat and possibly faster wear and tear down the road.
Point is slipons are easy and no matter what the Dealer is telling you...they don't have a "map" download that matches every slipon and air cleaner combination out there unless you're using stock Harley parts. So a download is pretty much a waste of money if you're using aftermarket parts - not that it won't help.
Anyhow, better to get a full blown management device if you plan to do more than slipons but as stated, many are running without, even with an A/C...
But please...don't take my word for it. Read all I have stated above in about 10 different Harley mags, and only 10,000 threads on this site alone...
Having done the research myself for the last 4 years it basically comes down to this: What are you comfortable with? DO it.
lp
The point is the newer ECM with O2s will adjust for small changes. Slipons are considered a small change as it does NOT change the fuel mixture or amount of air (typically) entering the engine - for the most part. That said, the ECM will try to keep the mix at a decidedly Lean(stock) mixture which leads to heat and possibly faster wear and tear down the road.
Point is slipons are easy and no matter what the Dealer is telling you...they don't have a "map" download that matches every slipon and air cleaner combination out there unless you're using stock Harley parts. So a download is pretty much a waste of money if you're using aftermarket parts - not that it won't help.
Anyhow, better to get a full blown management device if you plan to do more than slipons but as stated, many are running without, even with an A/C...
But please...don't take my word for it. Read all I have stated above in about 10 different Harley mags, and only 10,000 threads on this site alone...
Having done the research myself for the last 4 years it basically comes down to this: What are you comfortable with? DO it.
lp
HD600
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Not here to argue...the op asked for advice...I gave him mine...just as you have expressed yours. I had put on a set of Joker Machine slip-ons and was told "by the dealer" that no remap was needed...and I believed them...right up until the next service when the spark plugs were pulled. Sorry...not buying into anything other than what my personal experience has been. As I stated initially....some advertise no remap needed...others want more air flow, which as you stated requires a modification to the air cleaner...and subsquent alteration to the map.
Again...my advise....don't go cheap...get a stage 1 done or hook up with a place like Fuel Moto and do it yourself...the benefits of a cooler running and smoother engine are, at least in my PERSONAL OPINION are worth it.
Last edited by SlowRain; Dec 13, 2009 at 10:55 AM.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 11,463
Likes: 2,990
From: Charleston, SC
There are many manufactures...that depending on the slip on being used, advise in favor or remap. I am sure you can find lots who say "not needed" and apparently I can find some who say the opposite.
Not here to argue...the op asked for advice...I gave him mine...just as you have expressed yours.
Not here to argue...the op asked for advice...I gave him mine...just as you have expressed yours.
Something to think about I guess.
lp
Last edited by lp; Dec 13, 2009 at 11:35 AM.
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