Mod advice
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Cruiser
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 113
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From: Reno NV
Mod advice
From '02 Heritage (I still have my V-Rod) to a '10 Street Glide---> Help! I need performance. The bike is stock except for an underframe oil cooler, and a Vance & Hines slip on.
What next? I realize I need a race tuner. Is one better than the other? Is there one that will get me close to good performance without a $500 dyno run?
I am an old school carb guy and I bought my V-rod (wife did as a present for me
) with a stage II kit already installed. So, I am an EFI/ECM novice. But, I do my way around a wrench!
Thanks guys!
Oh, and I will add - I knew this bike handled better than my Heritage in the first turn!!
What next? I realize I need a race tuner. Is one better than the other? Is there one that will get me close to good performance without a $500 dyno run?
I am an old school carb guy and I bought my V-rod (wife did as a present for me
) with a stage II kit already installed. So, I am an EFI/ECM novice. But, I do my way around a wrench!Thanks guys!
Oh, and I will add - I knew this bike handled better than my Heritage in the first turn!!
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,916
Likes: 31
From: earth
lot of tuner options now. Initially I put the PC III on my 06 SG, I wasn't really happy with the canned maps or the thought of someone else tuning my bike. Rather than buy a new tuner and waste the money I already spent on the PC III, I kept it and added the Daytona Twin Tec Twin Scan+ WEGO IIID. Like you I didn't know much about EFI but I knew I didnt want to dump dyno $$$ every time I decided to change something. It basically datalogs your AFRs under actual riding conditions and load, then you can analyze it and use the data to make adjustments to your tuner, whatever type. Anyway, its kinda old news now since there are so many auto tuning type systems available. I really dont know much about the other tuners, but I would suggest something with datalogging capability so you can tune it yourself. You really do need to retune anytime you change intake, exhaust, or both, cams, or whatever. A lot of folks will say you don't "need" to remap with just an exhaust or just an intake, but I have witnessed the AFR change in my existing map after just a muffler change, even a big difference after installing a freshly cleaned air filter. I guess its all in what you consider tuned and what you're willing to accept. TTS Mastertune seems to be the popular tuner with the most funcionality. I learned a lot along the way with my system, but if I did it again I would want something with more bells and whistles like the TTS. Never had mine on a dyno but the tuned stage I with 2:1 definately runs much stronger than stock, if want more than 10-15% increase in power you will need a cam.
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Cruiser
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 113
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From: Reno NV
TTS seems to be the answer here. If I can get my buddies to obligate a few hundred a piece (for NUMEROUS dyno runs), I am buying a used dyno for my shop on my property. Until then I will flounder at bit.
Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 14,744
Likes: 402
From: Phoenix '53, '88, '09 Big Twins
step one is to remove the catalytic converter from the header pipe. anything else on the intake, or the mufflers will not be effective with this in place.
think about cams- cams are the heart of the motor- select the right cam for your riding style, expectations and bike ( don't get a dyna cam for a bagger---for example, we need torque more than horsepower.
take care of these and the rest will fall in place.
understand that a really fast Harley will cost the equivalent of 2 Kawasaki 600's on top on your initial purchase price...and still not be near as fast as a 600.
( I have a quickish x-CHP FXR- and ride my bagger MUCH more)..and my bagger has only air cleaner, mufflers and xieds.( 09 model so no cat in my header)
So maybe $500 in minor reasonable upgrades which provide slightly more power.
which ever you decide you need a system approach which will match displacement, cams, intake, engione management and exhaust- it's way easy to go buy getting the best part in each category if they don't work with each other.
nightrider.com has some handy reading and dyno charts to keep you busy.
- and you have the vrod for going fast if you want.
mike
think about cams- cams are the heart of the motor- select the right cam for your riding style, expectations and bike ( don't get a dyna cam for a bagger---for example, we need torque more than horsepower.
take care of these and the rest will fall in place.
understand that a really fast Harley will cost the equivalent of 2 Kawasaki 600's on top on your initial purchase price...and still not be near as fast as a 600.
( I have a quickish x-CHP FXR- and ride my bagger MUCH more)..and my bagger has only air cleaner, mufflers and xieds.( 09 model so no cat in my header)
So maybe $500 in minor reasonable upgrades which provide slightly more power.
which ever you decide you need a system approach which will match displacement, cams, intake, engione management and exhaust- it's way easy to go buy getting the best part in each category if they don't work with each other.
nightrider.com has some handy reading and dyno charts to keep you busy.
- and you have the vrod for going fast if you want.
mike
Cruiser
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 203
Likes: 2
This is just my opinion and maybe a few others, but, do not get rid of the cats. Your in Nevada and the strict emission regulations is only a hop, skip & jump away from you. Add some slip on pipes, Arlen Ness super sucker air intake, change the cams to SE204's, add the TunderMax AutoTune, a set of performace wires, NGK iridium plugs and ride the **** out of it. The ThunderMax rules and the SE204's are overlooked way too often.
Road Master
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,209
Likes: 5
From: Michigan
you have a 500+ hp Camaro.... I think you know what you need to get some "performance" your not going to tune a 96 and magically find performance. Any of the popular tuners are going to make the bike run better and cooler but not add a lot of pep without adding some other mods. Just remember...no replacement for displacement
Thread Starter
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Cruiser
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 113
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From: Reno NV
you have a 500+ hp Camaro.... I think you know what you need to get some "performance" your not going to tune a 96 and magically find performance. Any of the popular tuners are going to make the bike run better and cooler but not add a lot of pep without adding some other mods. Just remember...no replacement for displacement
I guess I need to add it is a 49 state bike, if that makes a difference on the cats.
SE120RG - I do have fast toys. 0-30 none faster than my dirt bike (on the street). I am looking to cool the motor and have a little more pop. I 'normally' don't push my full size Harleys (don't need to
).razors edge - thanks for the advice. The heritage was easy to squeeze more tq and hp out of, but I know how to increase performance from keihin carbs, air box mods, and open exhaust. I know I need a good tuner and the rest I will address over time. I just hate ANYONE touching any thing I own that has an engine, I would rather do it myself. I will look into your items -thanks
Sidecar - So, Thundermax is the only one eliminates the wire throttle hesiation? That has to be very important. I would hate my wife to smoke me too bad from signal to signal on her '06 1200 (moderately modded).
Mike - I want to approach the mods kinda step by step. I want the tuner to open up the airbox, and continue to open up the exhaust first. Then as you and other have offered head off to bump sticks. I don't need a hot rod, just a little more umph than I am experiencing. Can the cats be removed from the head pipes, or do the head pipes have to go?
Once again every opinion is valued, so thanks! I will stress that I will be doing this step by step, and correct my steps here but, this is how I want to tackle this:
-race tuner
-Immediately open up the air flow
-Immediately open up the exhaust
-next year - cams
-two years (if I don't change bikes) 103 jugs & pistons.
Once again, I don't need a hotrod, I have those in my garage already. I do want a glide that can pull me hard out of the twisties.
Thanks again and again!
Last edited by Strick; Jun 2, 2011 at 09:40 AM.
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Cruiser
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From: Reno NV
The small block in the Camaro is a 408" (stroked and bored to the hilt).
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Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,916
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From: earth
I believe you're thinking right by putting the tuner at the top of the list. Many here have touted great success with decatting the stock head pipe, that can be done immediately if you got the ability to cut and weld. About any aftermarket air cleaner will flow more than your motor will use, so pick whichever one you like. You got plenty of time to figure out what cams will work for what you want to do.
Cruiser
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 174
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From: huntsville
Don't forget to check out Revolution Performance Precision EMS For what is is worth. I just got mine and waiting for my ECM to come back. You never have to adjust anything and keeps your bike optimized for the best performance even when you add upgrades up to 25 percent fro the base ECM flash....
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