Help..installede new cams now oil pump not working
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Intermediate
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 32
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From: San Diego, CA
Help..installede new cams now oil pump not working
Have an 09 Ultra Classic, I installed a new set of cams..all went well except when I was puting the cam support plate back in had to close the last 3/8 inches by tightning the scews. Got it all together and fired it up. Was it ever loud! figured it would quite down when the oil reached the rockers, but it did not. Soo.. gues /i get to tear it all down again. This time I will remove the oil pump and inspect it. Any ideas what the problem was or what I'll need to do when I tear her down?
Road Warrior
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,945
Likes: 4
From: Victoria, Australia
Unless you forgot to install the O rings completely, the motor should show some oil pressure with a pinched or even a slightly displaced O ring. It will sump oil into the crankcase which you don't want, but you should have at least some oil pressure on the gauge.
I suggest you pull the cam plate and check the O rings and the alignment of the oil pump (provided you took the oil pump off the cam plate) when you did the cams.
You don't need to pull the pump when you do cams, even though the Service Manual shows to do so. All you need do is to pull the cam plate, change cams, and place the cam plate with the oil pump into position over the crank shaft.
Just don't turn the motor over by hand after you have removed the cam plate until you have re-install the cam plate with the oil pump in situ.
If you did remove the pump from the cam plate re-read what dustball said. The service manual explains the process for pump alignment as well.
EDIT ADD: 09biker-- Sorry but I'm a bit confused with your comment "This time I will remove the oil pump and inspect it"-- I presume your saying you left the pump in place the first time? If so, my money is on missing pump O rings.
Let us know what you find when you open it up for future reference.
I suggest you pull the cam plate and check the O rings and the alignment of the oil pump (provided you took the oil pump off the cam plate) when you did the cams.
You don't need to pull the pump when you do cams, even though the Service Manual shows to do so. All you need do is to pull the cam plate, change cams, and place the cam plate with the oil pump into position over the crank shaft.
Just don't turn the motor over by hand after you have removed the cam plate until you have re-install the cam plate with the oil pump in situ.
If you did remove the pump from the cam plate re-read what dustball said. The service manual explains the process for pump alignment as well.
EDIT ADD: 09biker-- Sorry but I'm a bit confused with your comment "This time I will remove the oil pump and inspect it"-- I presume your saying you left the pump in place the first time? If so, my money is on missing pump O rings.
Let us know what you find when you open it up for future reference.
Last edited by V2Evo96; Oct 31, 2011 at 01:49 AM.
Thread Starter
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Intermediate
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
From: San Diego, CA
On the cam replacement I did leave the oil pump attached to the cam support plate, and replaced the o ring. I used Bel ray assymble lube with molylube solids on the new bearings and cams. Any chance this could have gummed up the pump?
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 38,640
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From: Honah Lee
Not sure how long you ran it but I started one the other day dry other then the oil I wet it with. Lifters were also down. With no oil pressure it idled at 2000k (at least 500 above normal for an FI cold idle) and I held my breath for I know a minute before it pumped up. Think most of the noise was from lifters tapping. At 2000 and all that racket I just knew something was wrong but soon as it pumped up it was fine
Road Warrior
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,945
Likes: 4
From: Victoria, Australia
When I did my cams I used the existing lifters left in place and had no problems with them bleeding down.
How many miles on the lifters and did you remove them if you removed them did you put them back in where they came from and in the same orientation?
You said you had to 'screw''down the cam plate the last 3/8 inch which is normal as you have to push the plate past the pump O rings for proper seating, but this should not take excessive force on the screws, which should be a gentle operation. Do you think the cam plate pulled in easy or with heavy resistance?
Since you didn't take off the pump there should be no need for re-alignment (of the pump) and as you know it can only go on one way over the crank pin.
I'm no tech expert and the above is from my experiences with a cams install. I do wish a trained tech would jump in here for you.
How many miles on the lifters and did you remove them if you removed them did you put them back in where they came from and in the same orientation?
You said you had to 'screw''down the cam plate the last 3/8 inch which is normal as you have to push the plate past the pump O rings for proper seating, but this should not take excessive force on the screws, which should be a gentle operation. Do you think the cam plate pulled in easy or with heavy resistance?
Since you didn't take off the pump there should be no need for re-alignment (of the pump) and as you know it can only go on one way over the crank pin.
I'm no tech expert and the above is from my experiences with a cams install. I do wish a trained tech would jump in here for you.
Cruiser
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 196
Likes: 2
From: Murfreesboro, TN
I see engine problems sooner than later. It can take a few seconds for the oil pump to prime and make pressure on an evacuated oil pump. I always remove the spark plugs, ground the plug wires and spin the motor to get oil circulating before starting an engine that has had the oil pump/cam plate out. As well as fill the pump with as much assembly lube as I can get to stay in the pump. Crank bearings especially do not like to spin dry. It's even worse loading them up with a running engine. I'm assuming there was break-in lube on the cams.
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Intermediate
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
From: San Diego, CA
Ok, tore the unit down tonight to see what the problem was. I had watched the S&S video on cam replacement before I did they job, and they said you do not hve to remove the pump..which is what I did. Apparently the rear gerotor gar was not aligned properly when it back together. There was a small sliver of metal it off the front of the crank. This resulted in the oil pump not seating against the back, and was about 1/4 inch off the rear stop. Needless to say the scaveng port was not even touching, there being the problem. I had to use a wheel puller to get it off. After inspecing it all apears ok. I will burnish the crank so the gear slides on easily and that should do it.
So a word to the wise when doing cam replacements do unbolt the oil pump from the cam support plate, and make sure it is properly seated before you install the cam support plate with the new cams.
So a word to the wise when doing cam replacements do unbolt the oil pump from the cam support plate, and make sure it is properly seated before you install the cam support plate with the new cams.
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Road Warrior
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 1,945
Likes: 4
From: Victoria, Australia
09BIKER - Thanks for providing feedback and glad to hear you have the issue in hand. I left the pump in situ as shown in the S&S video when I did my cams and fortunately had no problems.
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