Built the best engine cooling system...again

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Dec 9, 2011 | 12:50 PM

#31

iclick

Extreme HDF Member

Joined: Sep 2005

Posts: 11,615

Likes: 50

From: Baton Rouge, LA

Quote:

Originally Posted by nytryder

HD says 230*.

They say 230° is "normal," but that certainly isn't ideal even for synthetic oil. I would like my oil to stay <200°, but in summer it stays at 205° as long as I'm moving, hitting as high as 230° a few times per summer in gridlock traffic.

Dec 9, 2011 | 03:22 PM

#32

2black1s

Elite HDF Member

Joined: Nov 2010

Posts: 3,846

Likes: 173

From: Simi Valley, CA

Quote:

Originally Posted by iclick

I have an oil cooler installed and have played around with cooler fans on three different occasions, abandoning the projects each time because the fans failed. I would like to use a head fan but have not gone that route because I have Rivco air horns installed in place of the stock horn and neither the LeNale nor HD fan will fit. Fabrik8r's concept might work for me if the location could be moved to fit around the horns, although I don't have much room to work with, especially on the front cylinder. I've toyed with various ideas including mounting something like a Spal fan on the right-side of the engine, but nothing has come of it.

iclick -
First let me say that you are one of the forum members who's opinions I respect.

I also played with oil cooler fans, and while my fans did not fail from the bike environment, i.e., heat, vibration, etc., they did fail from road debris. When I took them apart I found little gravel like pebbles had found their way into the fan motors and bound them up. When I disassembled the fans and removed the road debris they worked fine again. Protecting the fans with a screen would probably solve the problem I found, but I simply opted to remove them. I may play around with them again at some point but I'm not sure.

Now as for cylinder head (or engine cooling) fans, whether the LeNale, fabrik8r's design, or any other, they are definitely a worthwhile pursuit. I will never remove the engine cooling fan from my bike, and if and when it ever fails, I will replace it immediately. From my experience and testing, there is no better bang-for-the-buck cooling methodology available. While oil coolers, and oil cooler fans do have their place, the engine cooling fans attack the heat at its source and minimizing that heat heat also has a relative effect on oil temperatures. If I were buying a new bike today, an engine cooling fan would be one of my first mods.

Last edited by 2black1s; Dec 9, 2011 at 03:26 PM.

Dec 9, 2011 | 04:18 PM

#33

tj316

Stellar HDF Member

Joined: Feb 2010

Posts: 3,121

Likes: 489

From: sunny florida

this looks like a good idea , I do not like the LeNale because I have a skull horn and do not want to remove it , what do the Love Jugs look like ?????

Dec 9, 2011 | 05:52 PM

#34

2black1s

Elite HDF Member

Joined: Nov 2010

Posts: 3,846

Likes: 173

From: Simi Valley, CA

Quote:

Originally Posted by tj316

... what do the Love Jugs look like ?????

Look at the original post (#1) by fabrik8r and there's a thumbnail of the Love Jugs. Personally I think they are too prominent and a bit overwhelming in their appearance.

Dec 9, 2011 | 08:51 PM

#35

Deuuuce

Elite HDF Member

Joined: Apr 2007

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From: Roseville, CA

Quote:

Originally Posted by fabrik8r

I'm good with that. lets add 7 degrees and call it a flat 180F for optimum, that was really my specific target with a small margin of error factored, but still haven't made it there yet, even with a fan assisted oil cooler and parade fans together, so I'm inclined to believe that too cool is not going to be a problem for very many people. While I agree that no you don't want any water in your oil, the oil temp does not have to reach the boiling point of water for the condensation to "burn off"; This is not my personal theory, its a long standing scientific fact that moisture will seperate from the oil at any temperature, it just does so faster as it gets hotter. Can you provide a link to the IIRC Engineers quote of 180F, that would definately be a qualified source, that I can quote in the future.

Yes you're right, Googling it it seems 180-200F is ideal. I think when a lot of cars do track days they are around 210-230 max iirc.

I don't have the link but it was from an SRT (Chrysler/Dodge Group) Engineer Chat Session on one of the LX related forums (LX/Charger/300/Challenger) forums.

Dec 10, 2011 | 07:16 AM

#36

fabrik8r

Thread Starter

Outstanding HDF Member

Joined: Jan 2010

Posts: 2,916

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From: earth

Quote:

Originally Posted by iclick

I did some tests one summer using the PCV-AT with a map switch, allowing me to toggle between a lean and rich map on the fly. The rich map was set to 13.5:1 and lean at stoich (14.6:1) in the cruise range. Running at 50-60mph over time I saw only ~7° difference in FCHT and no change in oil temps between the two maps. I monitored with the LCD-200 display unit from DynoJet for FCHT and the HD fairing-mounted gauge for oil temp.

iclick thanks for posting your results. I've mentioned several times in the past that it takes considerable enrichment to lower CHTs and oil temp. My equipment is a little slower to tune, But I saw about the same thing. You got to get into the low 13s or lower before you start to realize any lowered CHT benefits. For the most part the heat the rider feels in the saddle is exhaust heat and slight enrichment does cool down exhaust temp, but you could get the same effect by insulating your pipes. Many claim true dual pipes cool your bike down, no they don’t, they redistribute the rear cylinder exhaust heat to the other side of the bike, so instead of having the heat from both primaries on the same side, you have half the heat on both sides. It has been my experience that the factory type stoich cruise "lean" tune is very good for a street machine, contrary to popular belief it is powerful, responsive, its a clean complete burn, and it offers the best fuel economy. Tuners know this also, but they are in business to make money so they give people what they want, or what they think they want. Going beyond stoich into legitimate lean territory is where you get into the kind of heat that a naturally air cooled motor can't handle. The rich tune thing is a deeply rooted proven drag racing practice and I'm not going to try to convince anyone that it's a bad thing, but I am convinced that "lean" is a good thing on the street, I don’t need to shave an extra tenth of a second between red lights.

Dec 10, 2011 | 09:34 AM

#37

RAP

Road Master

Joined: Aug 2005

Posts: 1,049

Likes: 5

From: IOWA

2black1s...1+

Dec 10, 2011 | 02:23 PM

#38

fabrik8r

Thread Starter

Outstanding HDF Member

Joined: Jan 2010

Posts: 2,916

Likes: 31

From: earth

A2 model prototype ready for the proving grounds

Finished up a little bigger set, pushing more than twice the air as the original model. Untested yet, too cold and I got company this weekend, but I'll get some numbers out soon as I can. New housing design is 1 piece instead of the original 3 piece screw together, I like it better for strengthe and simplicity, but I also like the polished face on the others. These have a straight 45* chamfer around the screen where the other had a venturi type radius. Its workable I can tweak em to suit different appearance taste. I rattle canned these but if they were powdercoated the same color as the jugs, they would blend in real nice. Need some feedback on appearance, just cause it's functional doesn't mean it has to be ugly. Hope I can get moving before some cheap import steals my thunder. Trying to redesign to expedite production, how would you all feel about the mounting tab being welded on instead of the machined block I'm using now, it would greatly reduce production time and cost, or would a more costly machined billet mount be a desireable feature.

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