Originally Posted by grbrown

Further to what has already been said about tuners, what none of them provide is feedback on what they achieve. They can auto tune to their hearts delight, but that doesn't mean they give a smooth or optimum torque curve throughout the rev range. I will stick with my dynosaur dyno tune thanks, to optimise any future mods!

Originally Posted by Eshaw301

Totally false and once again, some misguided information posted on this forum from a source that is by no means an expert on anything being outdated. Probably didnt even do your own mods to your bike or even your own tuning...but you can give advice about whats outdated and whats not? Myself, SPEAKING FROM EXPERIENCE WITH BOTH MODS AND TUNERS ON METRICS AND HARLEYS, can tell you that all of the tuners on the market today will be perfectly fine for what you plan to do to your bike. If all you want is intake, head pipe and exhaust, then you should be fine with a Power Commander V, V&H Fuel Pak, etc. THE ADVANTAGES OF THE AFTERMARKET ONES, ESPECIALLY THE POWER COMMANDER V, are that they can be installed in a matter of minutes, can be setup for your bike with a simple download and "map flash" that literally takes about a 1/2 a second, and they can have the autotune feature added on. Yes, it will be "optimal" to have it tuned by a shop on a dyno, however, the drawbacks to that is it's a crap shoot trying to find a legitimate shop tuner who knows what he's doing. It's also a proven fact that the auto tune addition on the Power Commander V is so close to a dyno tune, its not even funny. Based on many tests, the autotune came within 1-5 horsepower of a dyno with an almost identical curve in both TQ and HP. Now if you want to spend $400 for an extra 1-5 points, go right ahead, its your money, and stupider things than that are done everyday. Im still trying to explain to myself how those results are "outdated". I have SE Heavy Breather, Cobra Powerport head pipes, and "gutted" CVO mufflers on my 2012 RGC 103, and the folks on this particular forum said that it would be hard to tune, and would sound like sh*t with the gutted mufflers and the open exhaust from the head on back. I did it anyways, and guess what? My bike sounds awesome, and the auto tune is immaculate. I can ride in 100 degree heat or 35 degree cold, and the bike runs the same because the autotune addition to my Power Commander V is doing its job and doing it well. No popping, no pinging, no excessive fuel burning, nothing at all. I know for fact I have saved over $800-1000 in tuning costs by purchasing the $300 autotune option for my PC-V.

THE ONLY TIME YOU WILL NEED ANYTHING MORE SUCH AS A POWER COMMANDER AUTOVISION OR A SEPRT, OR TTS AND A DYNO IS WHEN YOU ARE GOING ABOVE AND BEYOND THE TYPICAL INTAKE, EXHAUST, CAMS ROUTE. Even then, its still hard to beat an auto-tune module that is adjusting off of a really good map. Thats a proven fact and the research and information is available all over the internet, and not just here from somebody that heard someone say something and now is spreading it as fact.