Cams: Gear Driven V's Chain Driven..?
Thread Starter
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Tourer
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 411
Likes: 9
From: Orig Surfers Paradise Australia, then Riyadh Saudi Arabia, Tokyo, Toronto, now So Cal
Cams: Gear Driven V's Chain Driven..?
Hi all, im about to bite the bullet and do cams on my 09 SG 96" that already has Stage 1, PCV, Dresser duals & Monster Ovals.
I was, until about an hour ago, going with the Andrews 48H chain driven cams.
Just snuck in to discuss said cam upgrade with my Indie and while he likes the 48H's, he prefers the S&S 570G gear driven cams.
Now.. there is a considerable price difference:
Andrews 48H = $260
S&S 570G = $730 (comes in a kit with other goodies for the install)
My question to you experienced cam experts is;
Are the gear driven cams going to bring more to the table than the chain driven cams? meaning reliability/power across the range etc?
Is the drastic jump in $$ for the S&S kit really worth it?
I know many are very pleased with the Andrews 48H's, and after months of research on HD Forums etc was convinced that these were a good choice, and I still may buy them (!)
My riding style is not overly aggressive, but i do get on it every so often from lights and merging onto SoCal freeways, but I have no desires to go drag racing. 2up riding is about 20% of the time.
(I will also do SE adjustable push rods and get a dyno done at the same time as install)
Anyway.. thanks for your input in advance.
I was, until about an hour ago, going with the Andrews 48H chain driven cams.
Just snuck in to discuss said cam upgrade with my Indie and while he likes the 48H's, he prefers the S&S 570G gear driven cams.
Now.. there is a considerable price difference:
Andrews 48H = $260
S&S 570G = $730 (comes in a kit with other goodies for the install)
My question to you experienced cam experts is;
Are the gear driven cams going to bring more to the table than the chain driven cams? meaning reliability/power across the range etc?
Is the drastic jump in $$ for the S&S kit really worth it?
I know many are very pleased with the Andrews 48H's, and after months of research on HD Forums etc was convinced that these were a good choice, and I still may buy them (!)
My riding style is not overly aggressive, but i do get on it every so often from lights and merging onto SoCal freeways, but I have no desires to go drag racing. 2up riding is about 20% of the time.
(I will also do SE adjustable push rods and get a dyno done at the same time as install)
Anyway.. thanks for your input in advance.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 17,548
Likes: 7,173
From: Oxford, Nc
I have gear drive cams and love them. Installed at 81,000 miles and now going past 140,000 miles on the bike. Never plan to open the cam chest until I replace cams again.
That being said, I wouldn't go gear drive in an '09. The crank simply isn't as strong as the hot forged crank on '99 to '02 models and crank run out is a risk. But simply put, the chain upgrade with the hydraulic tensioners is just too simple to ignore IMO. Easy to install and much more forgiving of crank shaft runout, and as you already discovered, pretty cheap too.
Good Luck whatever you decide.
That being said, I wouldn't go gear drive in an '09. The crank simply isn't as strong as the hot forged crank on '99 to '02 models and crank run out is a risk. But simply put, the chain upgrade with the hydraulic tensioners is just too simple to ignore IMO. Easy to install and much more forgiving of crank shaft runout, and as you already discovered, pretty cheap too.
Good Luck whatever you decide.
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 6,129
Likes: 143
From: Santa Cruz
I wouldn't spend the cash on gear drive over your hyd tensioners. No performance advantage on the street and shoes are lasting 50k plus easy. So check at 50k or even replace at 50k and ya can go around 500k to pay for gears? 48s are good choice in your 96.
Thread Starter
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Tourer
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 411
Likes: 9
From: Orig Surfers Paradise Australia, then Riyadh Saudi Arabia, Tokyo, Toronto, now So Cal
Thanks guys, can I have a quick lesson, just for my own learning curve?:
1) "crank runout" what exactly is that?
2) Hydraulic tensioners for the chain driven cams, i assume this is a part that I would need to buy with the 48h's?
thx
1) "crank runout" what exactly is that?
2) Hydraulic tensioners for the chain driven cams, i assume this is a part that I would need to buy with the 48h's?
thx
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 17,548
Likes: 7,173
From: Oxford, Nc
2) You already have hydraulic tensioners, an improvement also introduced on the '06 Dynas and '07 everything else big twin. So use what ya' got!
Last edited by Stiggy; Dec 10, 2013 at 06:27 PM.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 10,602
Likes: 721
From: Bellevue, NE
I had no intention of using gear driven cams in my 2011 96", but I checked the runout when I had it apart. Wish I hadn't, it was almost .008! Oh well, she runs good with the 48's, but the compensator is shot at 19k.
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Tourer
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 411
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From: Orig Surfers Paradise Australia, then Riyadh Saudi Arabia, Tokyo, Toronto, now So Cal
1) Run out is how much the ends of the crank "wobble." On my '00 the acceptable limit was .003" or Harley bought you a new engine when under warranty. Today the "acceptable" run out is all the way up to .012", a heck of alot of wobble and gears would shatter at that tolerance. The reason? Since '07 with their cast cranks now, they simply can't maintain the previous close tolerances of yesteryear when the cranks were forged. (That's why I have the better bottom end.)
2) You already have hydraulic tensioners, an improvement also introduced on the '06 Dynas and '07 everything else big twin. So use what ya' got!
2) You already have hydraulic tensioners, an improvement also introduced on the '06 Dynas and '07 everything else big twin. So use what ya' got!
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Tourer
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 372
Likes: 1
From: Denver Colorado
Those with gears will say gears and those with chain will say chain. Fact is that chain will work on all and are easier and less expensive to install. I'm a chain supporter. DYI or find an Indy. Not that difficult. Be sure you have a manual and take your time.
Road Warrior
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,575
Likes: 7
From: Wisconsin
I've had both gear drive cams and chain drive. Gear drive cams are 100% rock solid and maintenance free once installed properly. That said, the improvements in the '07 and newer chain drive and cam tensioners have all but obsoleted the need for gear drive cams in most typical street applications.
My '02 had S&S gear drive cams, but my '10 and'12 have chain drive Wood cams.
If you had a '99 to '06, it was close money whether you did the '07 and up cam chest upgrade with new cams or put in gear drive cams. With the added reliability of gear drives, gears were a popular decision. On your '09 there really isn't a need for gear drive cams from a reliability stand point.
Good luck.
My '02 had S&S gear drive cams, but my '10 and'12 have chain drive Wood cams.
If you had a '99 to '06, it was close money whether you did the '07 and up cam chest upgrade with new cams or put in gear drive cams. With the added reliability of gear drives, gears were a popular decision. On your '09 there really isn't a need for gear drive cams from a reliability stand point.
Good luck.
Last edited by equandt; Dec 10, 2013 at 08:13 PM.