The Everything 2018+ Heritage Thread
#1261
01-31-2019, 12:25 PM
Tourer
Let us know how things go. I will guess at the dealer :-) I hope to find a service department / technician I can go to and trust. Eventually there will be something I'll want that would be easier to pay someone to do. Good luck!
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Tom Thompson (01-31-2019)
#1262
01-31-2019, 12:33 PM
Grand HDF Member
They’re going to use the power vision tune. I’m sure the zipper Cam is not EPA compliant . But what I have read it is one of the best cams for the Milwaukee eight engine . I called the next dealer closest to me which they would use a SE cam and They would also do the Dina vision tune .Both dealers said the SE tuner Is not much good for anything
Denial of Warranty
a. Defendants shall deny all warranty claims for functional defects of powertrain components for any Harley-Davidson vehicle (Model Year 2017 or later) registered in the United States, if any Defendants have any information to show that such vehicle was tuned using a Tuning Product that was not covered by a California ARB Executive Order or otherwise approved by EPA.
b. Defendants shall instruct Harley-Davidson dealers to deny such warranty claims where any Defendant or any Harley-Davidson dealer has any such information.
c. No later than December 31, 2016, Defendants shall ensure that their warranty policies and product literature state that Defendants will deny warranty claims for functional defects of powertrain components for any Harley-Davidson vehicle, Model Year 2017 or later, that was tuned using a Tuning Product that was not covered by a California ARB Executive Order, or otherwise approved by EPA.
a. Defendants shall deny all warranty claims for functional defects of powertrain components for any Harley-Davidson vehicle (Model Year 2017 or later) registered in the United States, if any Defendants have any information to show that such vehicle was tuned using a Tuning Product that was not covered by a California ARB Executive Order or otherwise approved by EPA.
b. Defendants shall instruct Harley-Davidson dealers to deny such warranty claims where any Defendant or any Harley-Davidson dealer has any such information.
c. No later than December 31, 2016, Defendants shall ensure that their warranty policies and product literature state that Defendants will deny warranty claims for functional defects of powertrain components for any Harley-Davidson vehicle, Model Year 2017 or later, that was tuned using a Tuning Product that was not covered by a California ARB Executive Order, or otherwise approved by EPA.
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Tom Thompson (01-31-2019)
#1264
01-31-2019, 02:09 PM
Grand HDF Member
Before you gamble your warranty, why not call a few more dealers and tell them what you've been told, and see what they say... if there's truly something where a Power Vision won't void the warranty, I'd think every one of us would want to know it.
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Tom Thompson (01-31-2019)
#1265
01-31-2019, 03:18 PM
Road Master
#1266
01-31-2019, 03:56 PM
Novice
Yeah, I don't think so. That would be front-page news on every forum and in every magazine if it were true.
Before you gamble your warranty, why not call a few more dealers and tell them what you've been told, and see what they say... if there's truly something where a Power Vision won't void the warranty, I'd think every one of us would want to know it.
Before you gamble your warranty, why not call a few more dealers and tell them what you've been told, and see what they say... if there's truly something where a Power Vision won't void the warranty, I'd think every one of us would want to know it.
#1267
01-31-2019, 04:21 PM
Grand HDF Member
That's not how it works.
Well, let me back up -- there are two ways it can work. 1, they use a PowerVision or TTS or Screamin' Eagle Pro Street Tuner, and flash a new tune into your bike's computer. That's the way the vast majority of tuning is done, and the ONLY way you can do it without losing your warranty is to use the Harley SEPST tuner.
2, they can use a non-flash-based tuner. Something like a Dynojet Power Commander V. That kind of tuner doesn't flash the engine computer, so it could be potentially removed without leaving a trace. It also isn't a very good tuning device when compared to a flash tuner. I asked one of the best tuning guys in the country his opinion of using a Power Commander instead of a flash tuner, and he said he wouldn't even bother, there's no point when compared to how much you can accomplish with a flash tuner. So -- if they're using that type of tuning, then they would be conspiring to violate the terms of the EPA's Consent Decree with Harley; if you read it again you'll see where it says that Harley must tell their dealers, and their dealers must tell Harley, and if either the dealer or Harley knows of any tuning that's done with a non-EPA-approved CARB-approved tuning device, then Harley MUST void the warranty.
So -- short answer, either they're lying to you or you just aren't understanding what they're saying, but -- I mean, you can't get a proper aftermarket Dynojet tune without voiding your warranty. You can't. Unless you use the SEPST tuner, in which case some level of tuning can be done, but I think most tuning professionals would agree that the quality of the tune you'd get probably isn't really worth doing and certainly not worth the money it would cost.
Well, let me back up -- there are two ways it can work. 1, they use a PowerVision or TTS or Screamin' Eagle Pro Street Tuner, and flash a new tune into your bike's computer. That's the way the vast majority of tuning is done, and the ONLY way you can do it without losing your warranty is to use the Harley SEPST tuner.
2, they can use a non-flash-based tuner. Something like a Dynojet Power Commander V. That kind of tuner doesn't flash the engine computer, so it could be potentially removed without leaving a trace. It also isn't a very good tuning device when compared to a flash tuner. I asked one of the best tuning guys in the country his opinion of using a Power Commander instead of a flash tuner, and he said he wouldn't even bother, there's no point when compared to how much you can accomplish with a flash tuner. So -- if they're using that type of tuning, then they would be conspiring to violate the terms of the EPA's Consent Decree with Harley; if you read it again you'll see where it says that Harley must tell their dealers, and their dealers must tell Harley, and if either the dealer or Harley knows of any tuning that's done with a non-EPA-approved CARB-approved tuning device, then Harley MUST void the warranty.
So -- short answer, either they're lying to you or you just aren't understanding what they're saying, but -- I mean, you can't get a proper aftermarket Dynojet tune without voiding your warranty. You can't. Unless you use the SEPST tuner, in which case some level of tuning can be done, but I think most tuning professionals would agree that the quality of the tune you'd get probably isn't really worth doing and certainly not worth the money it would cost.
Last edited by FatBob2018; 01-31-2019 at 04:23 PM.
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Tom Thompson (01-31-2019)
#1268
01-31-2019, 04:51 PM
Over here in the UK buying accessories from the US can work out very expensive by the time you add on postage and duty.
With that in mind I have a question for you:
If you had to choose between a recurve windscreen or fangs, to try to reduce helmet buffeting which would you choose?
If it's pertinent, the wind actually hits me right in the eyes.
Thanks in advance.
With that in mind I have a question for you:
If you had to choose between a recurve windscreen or fangs, to try to reduce helmet buffeting which would you choose?
If it's pertinent, the wind actually hits me right in the eyes.
Thanks in advance.
#1269
01-31-2019, 05:02 PM
Novice
That's not how it works.
Well, let me back up -- there are two ways it can work. 1, they use a PowerVision or TTS or Screamin' Eagle Pro Street Tuner, and flash a new tune into your bike's computer. That's the way the vast majority of tuning is done, and the ONLY way you can do it without losing your warranty is to use the Harley SEPST tuner.
2, they can use a non-flash-based tuner. Something like a Dynojet Power Commander V. That kind of tuner doesn't flash the engine computer, so it could be potentially removed without leaving a trace. It also isn't a very good tuning device when compared to a flash tuner. I asked one of the best tuning guys in the country his opinion of using a Power Commander instead of a flash tuner, and he said he wouldn't even bother, there's no point when compared to how much you can accomplish with a flash tuner. So -- if they're using that type of tuning, then they would be conspiring to violate the terms of the EPA's Consent Decree with Harley; if you read it again you'll see where it says that Harley must tell their dealers, and their dealers must tell Harley, and if either the dealer or Harley knows of any tuning that's done with a non-EPA-approved CARB-approved tuning device, then Harley MUST void the warranty.
So -- short answer, either they're lying to you or you just aren't understanding what they're saying, but -- I mean, you can't get a proper aftermarket Dynojet tune without voiding your warranty. You can't. Unless you use the SEPST tuner, in which case some level of tuning can be done, but I think most tuning professionals would agree that the quality of the tune you'd get probably isn't really worth doing and certainly not worth the money it would cost.
Well, let me back up -- there are two ways it can work. 1, they use a PowerVision or TTS or Screamin' Eagle Pro Street Tuner, and flash a new tune into your bike's computer. That's the way the vast majority of tuning is done, and the ONLY way you can do it without losing your warranty is to use the Harley SEPST tuner.
2, they can use a non-flash-based tuner. Something like a Dynojet Power Commander V. That kind of tuner doesn't flash the engine computer, so it could be potentially removed without leaving a trace. It also isn't a very good tuning device when compared to a flash tuner. I asked one of the best tuning guys in the country his opinion of using a Power Commander instead of a flash tuner, and he said he wouldn't even bother, there's no point when compared to how much you can accomplish with a flash tuner. So -- if they're using that type of tuning, then they would be conspiring to violate the terms of the EPA's Consent Decree with Harley; if you read it again you'll see where it says that Harley must tell their dealers, and their dealers must tell Harley, and if either the dealer or Harley knows of any tuning that's done with a non-EPA-approved CARB-approved tuning device, then Harley MUST void the warranty.
So -- short answer, either they're lying to you or you just aren't understanding what they're saying, but -- I mean, you can't get a proper aftermarket Dynojet tune without voiding your warranty. You can't. Unless you use the SEPST tuner, in which case some level of tuning can be done, but I think most tuning professionals would agree that the quality of the tune you'd get probably isn't really worth doing and certainly not worth the money it would cost.
#1270
01-31-2019, 05:12 PM
Grand HDF Member
Well, that's more like it -- yes, it's absolutely going to void your Harley warranty. If you're ever on a trip and need service, you'll be screwed. So is the dealer who's insisting on voiding your warranty, willing to provide you a written dealership warranty where they guarantee repairs on your bike?
If not -- then is it really worth it to you?
You can get the Harley Stage II, which will give you 90% or more of the power of the aftermarket stuff, and to hell with their dyno tune, and spend a lot less money and be completely legal and have warranty everywhere. Or, you can use their aftermarket cam, and pay them 3 additional hours of labor for dyno tuning, and watch as they irrevocably void your warranty at every dealership in the country, and then maybe they'll provide you an in-house warranty, maybe not.
My take? They're doing this to try to sell you a more expensive tuner and to charge you three extra hours of labor. Screw those guys. They're screwing you out of your two-year warranty, all so they can pocket an extra three hours of labor. With the Harley Stage II, you'll pay for five or six hours of labor, not nine. And once your warranty is expired, you can then take the bike to Bob Lobenberg or The Dyno Difference or somewhere else like that, a top shop, and have it tuned by the best guys in the business, rather than whoever's working at that Harley dealership.
But, hey, if you want the RS468, go ahead, just understand that they are purposely charging you more, and selling you a more expensive tuner, and spending time on the dyno, and voiding your warranty. If that tradeoff is worth it to you, go ahead, just go in with your eyes wide open.
If not -- then is it really worth it to you?
You can get the Harley Stage II, which will give you 90% or more of the power of the aftermarket stuff, and to hell with their dyno tune, and spend a lot less money and be completely legal and have warranty everywhere. Or, you can use their aftermarket cam, and pay them 3 additional hours of labor for dyno tuning, and watch as they irrevocably void your warranty at every dealership in the country, and then maybe they'll provide you an in-house warranty, maybe not.
My take? They're doing this to try to sell you a more expensive tuner and to charge you three extra hours of labor. Screw those guys. They're screwing you out of your two-year warranty, all so they can pocket an extra three hours of labor. With the Harley Stage II, you'll pay for five or six hours of labor, not nine. And once your warranty is expired, you can then take the bike to Bob Lobenberg or The Dyno Difference or somewhere else like that, a top shop, and have it tuned by the best guys in the business, rather than whoever's working at that Harley dealership.
But, hey, if you want the RS468, go ahead, just understand that they are purposely charging you more, and selling you a more expensive tuner, and spending time on the dyno, and voiding your warranty. If that tradeoff is worth it to you, go ahead, just go in with your eyes wide open.
Last edited by FatBob2018; 01-31-2019 at 05:13 PM.
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