Proper way to down shift?
Road Warrior
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,298
Likes: 0
From: CA Desert
I've never understood the concept of downshifting when coming to a stop. I've never done it with any manual tranny cars I've owned and I've never done it on my bikes. It's the least efficient way to slow the bike down, causes unnecessary wear on the clutch and primary chain, and because you can't modulate the stopping force you are applying to the rear wheel, you always risk a lock up--especially on anything other than clean dry pavement.
Slowing and stopping are what the brakes are for, not the clutch and the engine. Just my 2 cents.
Slowing and stopping are what the brakes are for, not the clutch and the engine. Just my 2 cents.
Also one reason why its nice is it would suck coming out of 6 and clicking all the way down to 1st,(could be more dangerous if your not counting your down clicks and let the clutch go at a low gear and a high speed thinking you werent that low,,major wheel lock up) ,,in a car i would understand,because its easy to go from 5th to N and so fourth, on a bike its just part of the gears and rpm range going down plus,the big plus while your doing it,it really helps you slow down alot! As for locking up the rear wheel,i would say maybe more practice or maybe even a riding school,because thats hard to do,unless your a super new rider! (not referring to you but people that have this problem!)
Just my 2 cents.
Last edited by Gwjvw; Jun 8, 2009 at 07:30 PM.
Road Warrior
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 1,317
Likes: 14
From: Idaho
Thanks :)
You guys are talking about two different things, but using one term and it's confusing me and probably others.
1) Downshifting= Shifting to a lower gear as speed is decreased to maintain proper gear to speed ratios for immediate response to any situation.
2) Compression braking= Utilizing the compression of the motor while slowing to assist in reducing the speed of a vehicle, downshifting to maximize the effect and to avoid stalling the motor.
In short, I always downshift when stopping. I sometimes utilize compression braking in conjunction with my front and rear brake to stop the bike. It depends on how fast I want to slow my speed.
1) Downshifting= Shifting to a lower gear as speed is decreased to maintain proper gear to speed ratios for immediate response to any situation.
2) Compression braking= Utilizing the compression of the motor while slowing to assist in reducing the speed of a vehicle, downshifting to maximize the effect and to avoid stalling the motor.
In short, I always downshift when stopping. I sometimes utilize compression braking in conjunction with my front and rear brake to stop the bike. It depends on how fast I want to slow my speed.
Just to repeat good post.. It all depends on how fast you are going & how fast you want to stop.
Elite HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,440
Likes: 148
From: Northwest
For you guys claiming undue wear on clutches and engine because of downshifting and using engine braking, you better stop accelerating and shifting up as well. Better just let your bike sit in the garage and not get any wear at all..... I've driven every kind of vehicle with manual trannys and clutches from small bikes to 18 wheelers (professionally).
I used to shift the truck with no clutch usage at all.... upshifting and downshifting.
When getting ready to downshift, I blip the throttle to raise engine rpm at the same time pulling the clutch and downshifting. When you release the clutch, the engine rpm should be at rpm it should be, for the speed you are going and the gear you are in. It's no big damn deal. I've never 'chirped' the tire or broke it loose while downshifting... unless it was on purpose.
So if you still disagree, fine.... but explain to me in detail exactly what "extra" wear the engine and clutch is going through while downshifting/engine braking, that is worse than you accelerating away from a stop?
I used to shift the truck with no clutch usage at all.... upshifting and downshifting.
When getting ready to downshift, I blip the throttle to raise engine rpm at the same time pulling the clutch and downshifting. When you release the clutch, the engine rpm should be at rpm it should be, for the speed you are going and the gear you are in. It's no big damn deal. I've never 'chirped' the tire or broke it loose while downshifting... unless it was on purpose.
So if you still disagree, fine.... but explain to me in detail exactly what "extra" wear the engine and clutch is going through while downshifting/engine braking, that is worse than you accelerating away from a stop?
Road Warrior
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,530
Likes: 1
From: Upstate, SC
For you guys claiming undue wear on clutches and engine because of downshifting and using engine braking, you better stop accelerating and shifting up as well. ... So if you still disagree, fine.... but explain to me in detail exactly what "extra" wear the engine and clutch is going through while downshifting/engine braking, that is worse than you accelerating away from a stop?
Road Warrior
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,443
Likes: 3
From: Sasser, GA
It's the least efficient way to slow the bike down, causes unnecessary wear on the clutch and primary chain, and because you can't modulate the stopping force you are applying to the rear wheel, you always risk a lock up--especially on anything other than clean dry pavement.
As far as efficiency goes, I agree that the brake lever (and pedal to a lesser degree) is the ticket. In an emergency stop, the last thing on mind is engine braking.
Elite HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 4,440
Likes: 148
From: Northwest
If the clutch is not slipping, where is the wear?
Just for argument sake here, what do you do on an extended downhill stretch?
Tourer
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 352
Likes: 1
From: iowa
[quote=Just for argument sake here, what do you do on an extended downhill stretch?[/quote]after reading 5 pages of this thread I can safely say I think argument's sake has sufficiently been established.................... but please, do proceed
also,
Originally Posted by Phrogman
You guys are talking about two different things, but using one term and it's confusing me and probably others.
1) Downshifting= Shifting to a lower gear as speed is decreased to maintain proper gear to speed ratios for immediate response to any situation.
2) Compression braking= Utilizing the compression of the motor while slowing to assist in reducing the speed of a vehicle, downshifting to maximize the effect and to avoid stalling the motor.
In short, I always downshift when stopping. I sometimes utilize compression braking in conjunction with my front and rear brake to stop the bike. It depends on how fast I want to slow my speed.
+1 more here
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Tourer
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 460
Likes: 0
From: Western KY
Lol....well the question was "whats the proper way to down shift?"
Can one possibly glean a sure answer from these posts..... not likely. But thats the good thing about these forums. Lot's of good advice and opinions for you to ponder, and learn from.
From what anyone could gather, it depends on road conditions, your preference, your technical knowledge of the inner workings of a combustible engine/transmission and the proper gear to speed ratios, how much time you have, your experience level, and whether or not you give a crap about the way you stop as long as you don't smash into the object in front of you....
One of my favorite ways to stop is to jam the rear brake...slide about half sideways up to the folks at the corner and as soon as that blue rubber smoke blows past my face I turn with a serious look on my face and say... "****** A"
Can one possibly glean a sure answer from these posts..... not likely. But thats the good thing about these forums. Lot's of good advice and opinions for you to ponder, and learn from.
From what anyone could gather, it depends on road conditions, your preference, your technical knowledge of the inner workings of a combustible engine/transmission and the proper gear to speed ratios, how much time you have, your experience level, and whether or not you give a crap about the way you stop as long as you don't smash into the object in front of you....
One of my favorite ways to stop is to jam the rear brake...slide about half sideways up to the folks at the corner and as soon as that blue rubber smoke blows past my face I turn with a serious look on my face and say... "****** A"
Elite HDF Member
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 4,579
Likes: 10
From: S.E. MO
I always down shift to be in proper gear and I use engine braking also. As long as your not jamming it into way to low of a gear slight engine braking isnt going to hurt anything.
Personally I feel in better control with the clutch not engaged coming to a stop. I pull it to downshift and when I have to completely stop. There has been many of times I have had to hit the gas hard for some reason and dont wont to worry if I am in the right gear. To me its one of the many small things you do on a bike to minimize risk.
If that causes extra engine/clutch wear I am fine with it.
On my quads I used engine braking hard when running in the woods and never wore out a clutch.
Personally I feel in better control with the clutch not engaged coming to a stop. I pull it to downshift and when I have to completely stop. There has been many of times I have had to hit the gas hard for some reason and dont wont to worry if I am in the right gear. To me its one of the many small things you do on a bike to minimize risk.
If that causes extra engine/clutch wear I am fine with it.
On my quads I used engine braking hard when running in the woods and never wore out a clutch.
Last edited by bberck; Jun 8, 2009 at 10:23 PM.