How do PCV and autotune work?
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Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,114
Likes: 29
From: Vancouver B.C. Canada
How do PCV and autotune work?
I am not the type of guy spending $300 for one dyno tune, currently own a PCV and looking into autotune module. How good does it work? I was reading this on their website, does it mean I do not need a dyno tune? Here is what I want, I might want to add cams for now, do a 107 kit in winter, maybe some cylinder head work next year, I don't want to spend a fortune doing dyno tuning, like to do it in stages.
From the website
Dynojet Auto Tune kits for Power Commander V
Product Overview
Dont have a dyno tuning center nearby? Are you more of a D.I.Y. (do it yourself) type? Are you constantly changing parts on your bike?
If you answer "yes" to any or all of the questions above, then our Auto Tune kit is for you. The Dynojet Auto Tune kit is an "add on" accessory that can be used with any of our Power Commander Vs.
It connects to the PCV with a single cable and requires only a ground and +12 volt connection to be made to install (Harley models include connector for plugging directly into the bikes +12 volt line). If your exhaust does not already have one, a "weld in" O2 sensor bung is included.
"Well, how does it work and what does it do for me?"
We have taken virtually the same technology that our patented Tuning Link dynamometer software (for automated Dyno tuning) uses, along with Bosch Wide Band O2 sensors and miniaturized it to be used on your bike, ATV, or UTV, while you ride.
Once installed, the Auto Tune kit monitors the fuel mixture (by installing the included Wide Band O2 sensor in the exhaust). It then sends this information to the Power Commander V and automatically corrects it while you ride. Each map that we offer has preset Air/Fuel ratio values included that we find to be the best overall settings. This lets you simply plug in the unit and let it do the work. For Harley Davidson models we ever monitor and adjust each cylinder individually for increased precision as on these models required fueling can vary significantly between the front and rear cylinder.
For advanced users that would like to change the Air/Fuel ratios from our baseline they are fully adjustable. Each throttle opening/rpm combination is individually adjustable, so that you can have both fuel economy, during cruise, while maintaining peak output at larger throttle openings. For most models of bikes it is also possible to adjust the Air/Fuel ratios "per gear". This gives you total control of the fueling in every gear and throttle/rpm area if required.
From the website
Dynojet Auto Tune kits for Power Commander V
Product Overview
Dont have a dyno tuning center nearby? Are you more of a D.I.Y. (do it yourself) type? Are you constantly changing parts on your bike?
If you answer "yes" to any or all of the questions above, then our Auto Tune kit is for you. The Dynojet Auto Tune kit is an "add on" accessory that can be used with any of our Power Commander Vs.
It connects to the PCV with a single cable and requires only a ground and +12 volt connection to be made to install (Harley models include connector for plugging directly into the bikes +12 volt line). If your exhaust does not already have one, a "weld in" O2 sensor bung is included.
"Well, how does it work and what does it do for me?"
We have taken virtually the same technology that our patented Tuning Link dynamometer software (for automated Dyno tuning) uses, along with Bosch Wide Band O2 sensors and miniaturized it to be used on your bike, ATV, or UTV, while you ride.
Once installed, the Auto Tune kit monitors the fuel mixture (by installing the included Wide Band O2 sensor in the exhaust). It then sends this information to the Power Commander V and automatically corrects it while you ride. Each map that we offer has preset Air/Fuel ratio values included that we find to be the best overall settings. This lets you simply plug in the unit and let it do the work. For Harley Davidson models we ever monitor and adjust each cylinder individually for increased precision as on these models required fueling can vary significantly between the front and rear cylinder.
For advanced users that would like to change the Air/Fuel ratios from our baseline they are fully adjustable. Each throttle opening/rpm combination is individually adjustable, so that you can have both fuel economy, during cruise, while maintaining peak output at larger throttle openings. For most models of bikes it is also possible to adjust the Air/Fuel ratios "per gear". This gives you total control of the fueling in every gear and throttle/rpm area if required.
Road Warrior
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,739
Likes: 10
From: Suffolk, England
The problem with the PC tuners is that because they are piggy-back tuners (i.e. they don't reprogram the ECU like the SEPST, TTS, PV, etc) they require the O2 sensors to be disabled or these sensors would tend to undo the changes the PC was making.
To overcome this you can spend even more money to have an O2 sensor put back with the AT kit. This sensor is connected to the PC rather than the ECU as with the stock sensors, so it doesn't have the problems that the stock sensors cause the PC.
Now you have spent all that money fixing something the PC broke you can use a feature similar to that available with the other tuners: Auto Tuning.
Auto Tuning is not, despite what the blurb says, a substitute for a dyno tune. During a dyno tune the AFR and timing is adjusted, changes in performance are measured and the optimum settings are then saved to the ECU.
With Auto Tuning, a canned map is applied and then the actual AFR is measured to compare with the desired AFR in the canned map. The fuel is then adjusted so that the AFR actually used is an accurate reflection of what is in the canned map. This sounds good but is entirely reliant on the assumption that the canned map is the best map for your bike, but with no way of measuring the performance of the bike without a dyno you have no way of knowing if this is true.
Really its all a fudge on top of a fudge. Just get a proper tuner.
To overcome this you can spend even more money to have an O2 sensor put back with the AT kit. This sensor is connected to the PC rather than the ECU as with the stock sensors, so it doesn't have the problems that the stock sensors cause the PC.
Now you have spent all that money fixing something the PC broke you can use a feature similar to that available with the other tuners: Auto Tuning.
Auto Tuning is not, despite what the blurb says, a substitute for a dyno tune. During a dyno tune the AFR and timing is adjusted, changes in performance are measured and the optimum settings are then saved to the ECU.
With Auto Tuning, a canned map is applied and then the actual AFR is measured to compare with the desired AFR in the canned map. The fuel is then adjusted so that the AFR actually used is an accurate reflection of what is in the canned map. This sounds good but is entirely reliant on the assumption that the canned map is the best map for your bike, but with no way of measuring the performance of the bike without a dyno you have no way of knowing if this is true.
Really its all a fudge on top of a fudge. Just get a proper tuner.
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,921
Likes: 33
From: Lewisberry PA
Here is a thread that should you provide you some feedback on the AT.
https://www.hdforums.com/forum/touri...d-cooling.html
https://www.hdforums.com/forum/touri...d-cooling.html
Road Captain
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 521
Likes: 3
From: Colorado Springs, Co.
It sounds like to me from what they're desribing, all it does it turn your Harley into an OBD II Closed loop system, like all new cars have. Uses the O2 sensors to monitor oxygen in the exhaust to inform the PC what fuel adjustments it needs to make.
I don't really see the performance benefit of it, but for driveability, it sounds awesome.
I don't really see the performance benefit of it, but for driveability, it sounds awesome.
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