Twin Cam 88 upgrade: Considering the switch to a hydraulic cam tensioner system
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Road Master
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 809
Likes: 3
From: Honduras, Central America
Twin Cam 88 upgrade: Considering the switch to a hydraulic cam tensioner system
My bike is a 2005 FXD with 60K miles (and recently wrecked if you've noticed) Anyhow, I tired of having to check (and worry about) the spring loaded cam tensioners and have been considering an upgrade. Also keep in mind I live abroad and my options for machine shops and Harley dealer assistance is almost non-existent.
Forum member Spanner has been very informative as to what my options are, and based on his input I've come up with the following plan. Please check it out and tell me what you think:
1. I'll replace the spring-loaded tensioners with new ones just to be safe another 20,000 miles or so.
2. I wanted to switch to gear driven cams, but since there is the possibility of crank runout in an engine with that many miles, and since the country I live in (Honduras) doesn't seem to have shops that can weld and true the crank installing gear-driven cams without truing the crank would be a bad idea. So scratch that. (If I ask around machine shops they will say they can do it just so they can get the job, and probably botch my crank in the process)
3. In the end, like Spanner has said, the most viable option is to make the switch to the hydraulic cam tensioner system. I'm considering the SCREAMIN EAGLE HYDRAULIC CAM CHAIN TENSIONER CAM PLATE OIL PUMP KIT part# 25284-11 since it already comes with the oil pump upgrade I need to install. If you know of any other aftermarket option, PLEASE let me know.
However, for this particular kit to work, the instructions say I need additional parts:
- Spacer Kit P/N 25285-08
- Cam Service Kit P/N 17045-99D
- Drive Gear Retention Kit P/N 25533-99A.
How true is it that I need these so-called extra 'kits"? Or is it a ploy from Harley to get more money? As far as I know they're only washers and o-rings, does anyone know? Thank you very much for your help and input on this matter, it's critical!
Forum member Spanner has been very informative as to what my options are, and based on his input I've come up with the following plan. Please check it out and tell me what you think:
1. I'll replace the spring-loaded tensioners with new ones just to be safe another 20,000 miles or so.
2. I wanted to switch to gear driven cams, but since there is the possibility of crank runout in an engine with that many miles, and since the country I live in (Honduras) doesn't seem to have shops that can weld and true the crank installing gear-driven cams without truing the crank would be a bad idea. So scratch that. (If I ask around machine shops they will say they can do it just so they can get the job, and probably botch my crank in the process)
3. In the end, like Spanner has said, the most viable option is to make the switch to the hydraulic cam tensioner system. I'm considering the SCREAMIN EAGLE HYDRAULIC CAM CHAIN TENSIONER CAM PLATE OIL PUMP KIT part# 25284-11 since it already comes with the oil pump upgrade I need to install. If you know of any other aftermarket option, PLEASE let me know.
However, for this particular kit to work, the instructions say I need additional parts:
- Spacer Kit P/N 25285-08
- Cam Service Kit P/N 17045-99D
- Drive Gear Retention Kit P/N 25533-99A.
How true is it that I need these so-called extra 'kits"? Or is it a ploy from Harley to get more money? As far as I know they're only washers and o-rings, does anyone know? Thank you very much for your help and input on this matter, it's critical!
Former Sponsor
Joined: Aug 2005
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The cam service kit is needed If you reuse your stock pushrods and pull your rocker box covers and such. It is a nice kit as it comes with the stamped steel breathers and if you do not have them they are nice. The other two kits are just a few buks. I know for a fact that you will need the spacer kit, the other one I am not sure.
I have put this kit in two of my bikes and it has worked great in both. I am yet to pull the cover and check the tensioner shoes since the install and it has been quite a while so one of these weeks I will get to that.
If you put in adjustable push rods then you really don't need teh cam service kit but you will need a new cam cover gasket. I always order my inner and outer cam bearings separately.
I have put this kit in two of my bikes and it has worked great in both. I am yet to pull the cover and check the tensioner shoes since the install and it has been quite a while so one of these weeks I will get to that.
If you put in adjustable push rods then you really don't need teh cam service kit but you will need a new cam cover gasket. I always order my inner and outer cam bearings separately.
Last edited by Hogpro; Mar 20, 2013 at 12:02 PM.
Thread Starter
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Road Master
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 809
Likes: 3
From: Honduras, Central America
The cam service kit is needed If you reuse your stock pushrods and pull your rocker box covers and such. It is a nice kit as it comes with the stamped steel breathers and if you do not have them they are nice. The other two kits are just a few buks. I know for a fact that you will need the spacer kit, the other one I am not sure.
Yeah, I'm planning on keeping the same pushrods, so I'll need the cam service kit after all. What worries me though is that in most of the service videos I've seen the pushrods are cut with a wirecutter and then replaced with adjustable or EZ pushrods after the cam system has been installed. I guess they just do it because it takes less time than disassembling the pushrods themselves.
...and taking advantage that the cam plate will be down, I should change the bearings while I'm at it, but I'll need the $190 dollar tool to do so...
Road Warrior
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,465
Likes: 16
From: Nor Cal
There are sellers on ebay that rent the tools needed to change the cams and bearings. You will need some one to press in the cam & bearing in the plate. You do need the cam locking tool (I'm sure someone's jammed a piece of wood there and will say you don't need it) even if you don't change bearings. The advantage to cutting the push rods is that you don't have to take the top end apart. Since you are taking it apart to change the plate & tensioners. I would install cams and bearings. Or buy the tools and be the cam installer for Honduras.
Last edited by DanDman; Mar 20, 2013 at 04:43 PM.
Former Sponsor
Joined: Aug 2005
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It is quicker and easier to cut the old rodas out and put in adjustables as you do not avhe to remove the tank and rocker box covers. I always do adjustables as the price of teh push rods is worth more than the added time to remove the tank and rocker box covers.
Tourer
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 391
Likes: 0
From: Indiana
At 70,000 i would definitely check the cams you already have it apart. I just put one of those kits in my 99 Electra and I like the set up. If you have to replace the cams, my Andrews cams came with a couple spacers. I know it is getting expensive, but you might want to replace the lifters also with that many miles. Cam bearing tool can be purchased on ebay for just over $100 for the kit not made by Jim's, l bought one and it worked good. I agree if you have one and can do them for other people, it might pay for itself. Just my thoughts.
Tourer
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 391
Likes: 0
From: Indiana
The bearing puller/installer I bought is made/sold by a co. Called Whoya. Hope this helps. Pm me if you have any questions.
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Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2012
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From: Centennial, CO
Definitely do the inner bearings. The remove/install kit from Heartland products comes with the new Torrington bearings for $110. You didn't say whether you're installing new cams or not, my opinion is you may as well, but it's up to you. The press on the new bearings into the new cam plate is very light, one reason for the retention kit. Also needed is the oil pump alignment pins, again not very expensive.
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Thread Starter
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Road Master
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 809
Likes: 3
From: Honduras, Central America
Hehe, this is getting expensive real quick...and the 20:1 dollar to local currency exchange certainly doesn't make things easier!
Wouldn't that be something? Once I get the hang of this I can start doing it on other people's bikes for a pretty penny...good idea!
So it's at least $120 for the EZ pushrod set vs. $0 for taking the top end apart...hmmm, seems I'll have to disassemble! Besides, you can't put a price on the learning experience 
(well, unless I screw something up)
Oh man! The lifters too!? Well, I don't what kind of engine work was done on the bike before I got it, it could have new lifters for all I know. Anyhow, I can't assume the best so the lifters gotta go. Saw a Feuling set of 4 lifters at $245 [JP Cylcles] As for the cams, I really hope they're alright, I don't think I can afford all this at once, but I'll try cover as much ground as possible on the shortest amount of time.
The total for tools and parts is around $1,050. I'll be buying the spring loaded tensioners so I can start on the rest as soon as possible. I'm not really sure on what I should tackle first though, probably making the switch to the hydraulic tensioners should be my first step.
Originally Posted by DanDman
I would install cams and bearings. Or buy the tools and be the cam installer for Honduras.
Originally Posted by HogPro
It is quicker and easier to cut the old rods out and put in adjustables as you do not avhe to remove the tank and rocker box covers. I always do adjustables as the price of teh push rods is worth more than the added time to remove the tank and rocker box covers.
(well, unless I screw something up)
Originally Posted by Dangermouse
At 70,000 i would definitely check the cams you already have it apart. I just put one of those kits in my 99 Electra and I like the set up. If you have to replace the cams, my Andrews cams came with a couple spacers. I know it is getting expensive, but you might want to replace the lifters also with that many miles.
The total for tools and parts is around $1,050. I'll be buying the spring loaded tensioners so I can start on the rest as soon as possible. I'm not really sure on what I should tackle first though, probably making the switch to the hydraulic tensioners should be my first step.
Last edited by FXD_noob; Mar 20, 2013 at 09:07 PM.
Tourer
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 391
Likes: 0
From: Indiana
I would say if you don't have the money to do it all right, check your tensioners and let it ride for a little bit longer,save your money til you can do it right. You don't want to start replacing cams and not bearings, or lifters and not cams. **** will wear faster and you could end up re replacing ****.