Possibly a Bearing? Cannot figure out what the problem is
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From: NEPA
Possibly a Bearing? Cannot figure out what the problem is
I have a 2005 Road King Classic with 32K on it. Last season I replaced the cam chain tensioners with OEM replacements. Prior to doing the job i kept hearing a metal on metal squeaking at low RPM's, high fuel demand while at operating temperature. I kind of figured that that tensioners would not fix the problem.
This year i fired up my bike and got to thinking about the squeaking again. I figured i would take a look at the primary drive. I took it apart to find that the compensator sprocket nut was hand tightened and just about to fall off. I was somewhat relieved and also confused. I cranked it down to 160'lbs with some red locktite. It still squeaks.
The squeaking is somewhat high pitched and typically starts while at low RPM's if you are rolling on the throttle fully. It sounds like it is coming from under the tank, center engine, but who knows. It only does it while moving, with the clutch engaged.
Any suggestions as what to check? Tomorrow I am going to pull out the manual and start looking through the drive train.
Thank You!!
This year i fired up my bike and got to thinking about the squeaking again. I figured i would take a look at the primary drive. I took it apart to find that the compensator sprocket nut was hand tightened and just about to fall off. I was somewhat relieved and also confused. I cranked it down to 160'lbs with some red locktite. It still squeaks.
The squeaking is somewhat high pitched and typically starts while at low RPM's if you are rolling on the throttle fully. It sounds like it is coming from under the tank, center engine, but who knows. It only does it while moving, with the clutch engaged.
Any suggestions as what to check? Tomorrow I am going to pull out the manual and start looking through the drive train.
Thank You!!
The compensator nut has a revised spec of a torque and turn.
If you weren't so sure it was metal on metal I would say to check the belt especially if it does it going on and coming off the throttle.
Also, heat shields will make a lot of metal squeaks if loose and/or rubbing. Make sure your mufflers didn't slide back and are hitting the mount.
If you weren't so sure it was metal on metal I would say to check the belt especially if it does it going on and coming off the throttle.
Also, heat shields will make a lot of metal squeaks if loose and/or rubbing. Make sure your mufflers didn't slide back and are hitting the mount.
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From: NEPA
I appreciate the advice Ed (from the other response), but i have checked the belt, and also i thought for sure that the heat shields were going to be the problem after i heard, and saw how some of the clamps were, but unfortunately not. Both of those things were checked last year. I am going to go with checking the inner primary bearing and race.
My concern now is "will i need any specialty tools?" It seems as though everything i work on with this sled requires a specialty tool. For cranking down the Compensator Spocket Nut i just used a hard plastic handled brush wedged in the chain/sprocket.
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From: san antonio
The plastic handle brush will work; I fashioned my tool from an old lawn mower blade. If you have to dive into the primary, I suggest that you replace every seal in there; parts are cheap and it may save you returning there at some point in the future. If you don't have the service manual for the bike; that is the first tool you will need. In addition, you will need a tool to hold the trans pulley nut to R/R the nut; removal may require the rental of a 3/4" electric impact wrench; they can be a bitch to loosen. There is a "specialty" tool but you can avoid the tool by removing the trans top cover and putting the trans in two gears at once which will lock up the trans; more work but less money spent on tools. Most of the seal drivers are not required; you can use pieces of PVC pipe or just carefully tap them in. You will need the R/R tool for the inner primary race; pretty much a must have. You will need a press to R/R the inner primary bearing or fashion some sort of pull/push tool from all thread, washers and PVC pipe. If that bearing is really in tight, a fabbed up push/pull tool might not get the job done. You will also need the trans pulley nut deep socket and donut or by a socket, cut off the top part and weld in a piece of pipe the proper length and fashion a donut from a piece of wood or an old plastic cutting board. Good luck.
Inner primary bearing doesn't require belt sprocket removal - personally I'd leave that be unless you really determine there is a reason to remove it.
If it's the inner primary bearing, you will pretty much know as soon as you see the race.
Just out of curiosity, when you tightened the comp nut, did you inspect the rotor shell teeth and the inner and outer part of the shell for a worn groove?
If it's the inner primary bearing, you will pretty much know as soon as you see the race.
Just out of curiosity, when you tightened the comp nut, did you inspect the rotor shell teeth and the inner and outer part of the shell for a worn groove?
Last edited by Ed Ramberger; May 27, 2015 at 11:34 PM.
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From: san antonio
If there is no primary leak, the noise could be from another source. The terms "squeaking" and "metal to metal" suggest worn tensioner and chain to tensioner holder contact and/or a lifter roller going bad or freezing up. If the noise does not change when the clutch is engaged/disengaged, I would be looking in the cam chest first.
Last edited by djl; May 28, 2015 at 09:47 AM.
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From: NEPA
True that; however, if the OP is in the primary, it has been my experience that is the time to pull the trans pulley and replace the seals and spacer behind the pulley and push the "reason to remove it" down the road. Not that much more work, parts are cheap and, IMHO, well worth the time and cost to refresh sooner rather than later but that's JMHO; the OP can make the call. I guess one could call it "preventative maintenance".
If there is no primary leak, the noise could be from another source. The terms "squeaking" and "metal to metal" suggest worn tensioner and chain to tensioner holder contact and/or a lifter roller going bad or freezing up. If the noise does not change when the clutch is engaged/disengaged, I would be looking in the cam chest first.
If there is no primary leak, the noise could be from another source. The terms "squeaking" and "metal to metal" suggest worn tensioner and chain to tensioner holder contact and/or a lifter roller going bad or freezing up. If the noise does not change when the clutch is engaged/disengaged, I would be looking in the cam chest first.
The noise is only present while the clutch is engaged. It can be heard best when the bike is warmed up good, and i let the RPM's drop, then roll on the throttle. (better heard in 4th or 5th gear).
I've been thinking about the cam chest. I had to replace the cam chain tensioners last season. I replaced the inner cam bearings. But not the rear cam roller bearing, or front cam ball bearing. They did not come with the gasket/bearing kit. I was confused as to whether or not they typically got replaced or not. I believed one of them had a little bit of play it in that went away once the bearing retainer plate was installed. I should have known better and replaced them anyhow when i was in there (especially because its a pain in the *** to get into the cam chest because the exhaust has to be removed).
Does anyone have a suggestion as to trying to find out what side of the engine the noise is coming from?
The lifter roller seems like it would be a tough thing to try to isolate. ??
Last edited by SummitRK; May 31, 2015 at 04:08 PM.
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Joined: Jun 2006
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From: san antonio
"no primary leak?" I am a newbie to repairing the 88 TC so i'm not sure what you are referring to. Sorry. Leak in terms of where?
The noise is only present while the clutch is engaged. It can be heard best when the bike is warmed up good, and i let the RPM's drop, then roll on the throttle. (better heard in 4th or 5th gear).
I've been thinking about the cam chest. I had to replace the cam chain tensioners last season. I replaced the inner cam bearings. But not the rear cam roller bearing, or front cam ball bearing. They did not come with the gasket/bearing kit. I was confused as to whether or not they typically got replaced or not. I believed one of them had a little bit of play it in that went away once the bearing retainer plate was installed. I should have known better and replaced them anyhow when i was in there (especially because its a pain in the *** to get into the cam chest because the exhaust has to be removed).
Does anyone have a suggestion as to trying to find out what side of the engine the noise is coming from?
The lifter roller seems like it would be a tough thing to try to isolate. ??
The noise is only present while the clutch is engaged. It can be heard best when the bike is warmed up good, and i let the RPM's drop, then roll on the throttle. (better heard in 4th or 5th gear).
I've been thinking about the cam chest. I had to replace the cam chain tensioners last season. I replaced the inner cam bearings. But not the rear cam roller bearing, or front cam ball bearing. They did not come with the gasket/bearing kit. I was confused as to whether or not they typically got replaced or not. I believed one of them had a little bit of play it in that went away once the bearing retainer plate was installed. I should have known better and replaced them anyhow when i was in there (especially because its a pain in the *** to get into the cam chest because the exhaust has to be removed).
Does anyone have a suggestion as to trying to find out what side of the engine the noise is coming from?
The lifter roller seems like it would be a tough thing to try to isolate. ??
Last edited by djl; Jun 7, 2015 at 09:40 AM.
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From: NEPA
I did replace the cam chain tensioners with OEM. I don't know how much longer i will own the bike. I'd like to upgrade to a newer model, but only because of the lack of a 6th gear in later models. Anyhow, now that i can picture the whole setup, and how everything drives the motorcycle, and what part does what, i am confident that it can't be in the cam chain chest. It only happens while riding, and the clutch is engaged. I feel that it could be within the main bearing. So, with that said, how much of a PITA is it replacing that bearing? Taking the primary cover and the compensating nut and sprocket off isn't bad at all. I suppose i'll have to order the special tool, but that's not a big deal. This job is all labor! i refuse to pay someone for what i am capable of doing. Thanks for the help!