Harley Layoffs
Club Member
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,567
Likes: 1,940
From: NE Florida
The separation of wealth in this country is being largely driven by the elimination of organized labor and bogus "Right to Work" laws. ( NAFTA doesn't help).
I'm pro-Union and pro-labor. When I started looking for a touring bike I was looking at HD and Victory, one of the deciding factors for me was the fact that HD is a Union factory and Victory is not. I think this shows in the overall quality and finish of the bikes.
When it come's to skilled labor, like anything else you get what you pay for!
I'm pro-Union and pro-labor. When I started looking for a touring bike I was looking at HD and Victory, one of the deciding factors for me was the fact that HD is a Union factory and Victory is not. I think this shows in the overall quality and finish of the bikes.
When it come's to skilled labor, like anything else you get what you pay for!
Advanced
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 81
Likes: 21
From: Minneapolis
I'm not going to get into an Internet debate about this issue. No way it would end well. We are obviously on opposite sides of the war on organized labor in this country. You posted your anti-Union opinions and I posted my pro-Union opinions. To go any deeper on an Internet forum would be senseless. You are not going to change my stance and I'm sure vice versa. So let's just agree to disagree and leave it at that.
Advanced
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 81
Likes: 21
From: Minneapolis
[QUOTE=bwana1;15478771]Unionism is geared to mediocrity, the highly motivated productive worker is compensated the same as the slacker, cut and dried.
Ok, gonna keep this going I guess.
Sorry man but not as "cut and dried" as you think. Not all labor Unions are the same. Some Unions do shine a dark light on Unions in general, I realize and admit this.
Here's something that even friends and family with a non-Union viewpoint are surprised to learn. In many labor Unions such as skilled trade construction (Plumbers, Electricians , Pipefitters, Hvac etc etc.) there are no seniority rules. None, zero zip nada. You don't produce you get laid off. Period. Regardless of age, time in the union or with the company. Most Union trades involve four years of schooling and apprenticeship. Not all contracts are the same but the majority of us get zero paid vacations and only one paid day off. Labor Day actually. We make a good hourly wage but no work equals no pay. Period. Don't get paid for Christmas, Thanksgiving, sick days etc. etc.
Also the starting pay is just that, the more "motivated and productive workers" are free to ask for more money, company truck, car allowance etc. The contractors are free to pay over scale and they do.
So yeah, maybe not so "cut and dried".
Ok, gonna keep this going I guess.
Sorry man but not as "cut and dried" as you think. Not all labor Unions are the same. Some Unions do shine a dark light on Unions in general, I realize and admit this.
Here's something that even friends and family with a non-Union viewpoint are surprised to learn. In many labor Unions such as skilled trade construction (Plumbers, Electricians , Pipefitters, Hvac etc etc.) there are no seniority rules. None, zero zip nada. You don't produce you get laid off. Period. Regardless of age, time in the union or with the company. Most Union trades involve four years of schooling and apprenticeship. Not all contracts are the same but the majority of us get zero paid vacations and only one paid day off. Labor Day actually. We make a good hourly wage but no work equals no pay. Period. Don't get paid for Christmas, Thanksgiving, sick days etc. etc.
Also the starting pay is just that, the more "motivated and productive workers" are free to ask for more money, company truck, car allowance etc. The contractors are free to pay over scale and they do.
So yeah, maybe not so "cut and dried".
Last edited by SG -KJ; Sep 3, 2016 at 08:54 PM.
Advanced
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 81
Likes: 21
From: Minneapolis
Since this post was originally about HD lay offs and has gone off track. Here are some current wages for HD workers as of 8/22/16.
Assembler=$15.94 hour
Technician= $13.00 hour
Machinist= $31/$36 hour
Production Technician= $25/$33
Personally I do not think any of these are overpaid! I do not believe labor costs are the reason for HD bloated prices. Just my opinion, I could be wrong.........
Assembler=$15.94 hour
Technician= $13.00 hour
Machinist= $31/$36 hour
Production Technician= $25/$33
Personally I do not think any of these are overpaid! I do not believe labor costs are the reason for HD bloated prices. Just my opinion, I could be wrong.........
Last edited by SG -KJ; Sep 3, 2016 at 09:31 PM.
Road Master
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 1,193
Likes: 807
From: Washington
Get on Point!
Man, what a disappointing discussion. I thought Harley riders were all about craftsmanship and appreciating the details. Craftsmanship means attention to the fine points of the reality you are dealing with. So given that.....HD recently lowered their sales projections by 5000 units a year. That means they won't need as much resources to build bikes, including people. If you haven't been paying attention you might not have noticed that Polaris has been doing fairly well with their Victory and Indian brands. It doesn't matter if you don't like them, some people do and they have voted with their checkbook.
In addtion, one of the areas where HD is laying off staff is in their windshield & plastics manufacturing plant. Are you one of the guys going on about how they love their Klockworks Flare or LRS windshield, or some other brand? You could of bought a HD Windsplitter, but you didn't meaning your part of the problem. My point is this - sales drive production and production drives staffing and other resources. Quit blaming the unions, management, the CEO, Mexico, etc. Buy yourself a new bike or a new windshield to keep those guys on the line employed, or STFU.
In addtion, one of the areas where HD is laying off staff is in their windshield & plastics manufacturing plant. Are you one of the guys going on about how they love their Klockworks Flare or LRS windshield, or some other brand? You could of bought a HD Windsplitter, but you didn't meaning your part of the problem. My point is this - sales drive production and production drives staffing and other resources. Quit blaming the unions, management, the CEO, Mexico, etc. Buy yourself a new bike or a new windshield to keep those guys on the line employed, or STFU.
Road Warrior
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 1,865
Likes: 517
From: georgia
yep globally w/m and they might make $10.00 per hour at best could you live at that rate you would be pulling bills out of a hat because you could only pay 1 a week and keep food on the table
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Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 2,046
Likes: 314
From: Denver CO
Aussie dog makes some good points, but lets look at it from the person with the wallet in hand. Yes, buy more bikes. We all would love to go out every year and buy a new one I'm sure, But we all have to make smart choices with our money. Taking the windshield line as an example, I just bought a Klock Werks Pro-Touring Flare shield. Now I did look at the HD windsplitter, but honestly, I got a better deal on the Flare. Most of us have discretionary incomes, and have to watch closely what we buy. Hell, I have blowing a lot of money on top of my bike purchase. But every part I buy, I research to find the best price. Sucks, but that is my reality.