FF Study
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 7,638
Likes: 4,872
From: Missouri City,TX
...I wear a modular helmet cuz I ride w/o a windshield...it protects me from gettin' hit in the face from bugs, sand, other road hazards.I like my modular helmets...I don't give a **** what you wear when you ride, it's none of my business.
Club Member
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 69,901
Likes: 18,589
From: South Florida
This is what I have been wondering as well. Football helmets have this, just look at quarterback helmets, big field of vision.
One thing I didn't like about this study was the rider was on a fixed position with a 130 degree horizontal view. That won't give a ride a full 180 degree side to side peripheral view. I think that would have been a more useful test. It's a start but the report is a little weak for me. I wrote a paper in grad schedule about helmet laws and though the paper always comments on whether the rider had a helmet or not, the lack of helmet may not have been the cause of death. Potentially the rider had their femoral artery cut when the bike fell on them and they bleed out. Maybe the rider was blunt force trauma to the chest but their head was completely fine. The motorcycle statistics don't do a good job of breaking out the cause of death, just that there was a death.
Also, during my research, I found a paper that stated that 1: full face helmets do decrease peripheral vision (I forget the degree - it was small), 2: a full face helmet will protect your head up to 15 mph crash but above that, there was an increase to neck injury because of the weight of th helmet and the whiplash associated with the impact.
Disclaimer: this study was done in the 80's so it is horribly outdated to today as I just quickly found an article published in 2016 that trumps this research.
Back to the point on hand. I just moved to a full face from a half and I do notice a loss in peripheral vision. As mentioned, I think if they just made the cutout a little further back, that could solve the problem.
One thing I didn't like about this study was the rider was on a fixed position with a 130 degree horizontal view. That won't give a ride a full 180 degree side to side peripheral view. I think that would have been a more useful test. It's a start but the report is a little weak for me. I wrote a paper in grad schedule about helmet laws and though the paper always comments on whether the rider had a helmet or not, the lack of helmet may not have been the cause of death. Potentially the rider had their femoral artery cut when the bike fell on them and they bleed out. Maybe the rider was blunt force trauma to the chest but their head was completely fine. The motorcycle statistics don't do a good job of breaking out the cause of death, just that there was a death.
Also, during my research, I found a paper that stated that 1: full face helmets do decrease peripheral vision (I forget the degree - it was small), 2: a full face helmet will protect your head up to 15 mph crash but above that, there was an increase to neck injury because of the weight of th helmet and the whiplash associated with the impact.
Disclaimer: this study was done in the 80's so it is horribly outdated to today as I just quickly found an article published in 2016 that trumps this research.
Back to the point on hand. I just moved to a full face from a half and I do notice a loss in peripheral vision. As mentioned, I think if they just made the cutout a little further back, that could solve the problem.
I keep wondering..........if you cut more of the peripheral ends, that may weaken the helmet. ?? Sort of like cutting the helmet in half if u know what I mean.
Interesting.
You know, so many people wear helmets around the world, you would think this matter (as important as it is) would have been researched in depth and solved. Lot's of data and results.
BuzzCap7
Road Captain
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 587
Likes: 312
From: here n there
"The task consisted of negotiating curves in a fixed-based simulator while the helmet visor vertical dimension and need to check the handlebar-mounted speedometer were manipulated "
I don't know about you or these "researchers", but when I ride, I look where I want to go, especially while negotiating a curve; I'm NOT checking the speedometer.
And I always wear a FF, anything less is crazy IMHO. YMMV
I don't know about you or these "researchers", but when I ride, I look where I want to go, especially while negotiating a curve; I'm NOT checking the speedometer.
And I always wear a FF, anything less is crazy IMHO. YMMV
It would have been helpful if they'd relate the aperture angle to some commonly available helmets on the marked presently. I don't think mine interferes with my view at all, but I'm going to make a point to check next time I ride. Good reason to take a little run tomorrow if it's not raining.
The "wearing the gear makes you feel invincible" argument always seems to pop up in these discussions. I don't buy it. Many of the people you see riding really recklessly may have helmets on, but the rest of their body is totally exposed to terrible, irreversible damage. I guess you could argue that only the helmet has the "I'm invincible" effect...Anyway, I don't care if anyone else wears a helmet or not. Your head, your face, your choice.
Club Member
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 69,901
Likes: 18,589
From: South Florida
To me, wearing a helmet, or some gear or ATGATT, makes me feel more confident. Not cocky. Not reckless. There is a difference here my friends. Just more confident. No higher risk value associated here. Maybe lower risk due to the confidence.
BuzzCap7
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 10,001
Likes: 5,266
FYI. Although all motorcycle traffic accident studies dont go deep enough, the worst being government accident reports, I finally found a study that supports my personal experience of why not to wear a full face helmet.
Specifically, while a FF protects more of the head in a head accident, the riding safety it trades away is a danger to be considered. The more frontal coverage the worse it is, and more is getting more popular, or at least more advertised.
Im posting this for awareness. This seems to be a little known caution. The FF seems to be growing in popularity/acceptance/coolness. I hope its not just because racers use it, or of course its the safest. Over 50 some years Ive had lots of great rides with no helmet, ž, and FF. I started using a FF to be safer a few years ago like many others. However after a year of repeatedly recognizing danger Id not had before (or since) I stopped.
Ride Safe.
https://ir.uiowa.edu/drivingassessment/2015/papers/10/
Hopefully where you live you still have the option of no lid along with all the way from flip flops to lime atgatt, & black bike to lime with multi-lights/air horn/guard bars/air bags, depending on the ride, personal skills/experience/preference, and training.
Specifically, while a FF protects more of the head in a head accident, the riding safety it trades away is a danger to be considered. The more frontal coverage the worse it is, and more is getting more popular, or at least more advertised.
Im posting this for awareness. This seems to be a little known caution. The FF seems to be growing in popularity/acceptance/coolness. I hope its not just because racers use it, or of course its the safest. Over 50 some years Ive had lots of great rides with no helmet, ž, and FF. I started using a FF to be safer a few years ago like many others. However after a year of repeatedly recognizing danger Id not had before (or since) I stopped.
Ride Safe.
https://ir.uiowa.edu/drivingassessment/2015/papers/10/
Hopefully where you live you still have the option of no lid along with all the way from flip flops to lime atgatt, & black bike to lime with multi-lights/air horn/guard bars/air bags, depending on the ride, personal skills/experience/preference, and training.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 9,228
Likes: 3,241
From: west Michigan
In these FF helmet threads, we see who's had facial injuries from impact with pavement or another vehicle, and who hasn't. I have, and I usually wear a FF helmet. My Shoei RF1200 provides more peripheral vision than the first Bell FF that I bought in '85. All that means is that I have to turn my head a bit less when I look over my shoulder before changing lanes.
My off road helmet is also a FF, which means that I no longer have to wear a mouth guard when I'm dirt biking. IMO, the advantages of a FF helmet far outweigh any disadvantages.
My off road helmet is also a FF, which means that I no longer have to wear a mouth guard when I'm dirt biking. IMO, the advantages of a FF helmet far outweigh any disadvantages.
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 2,232
Likes: 615
From: San Antonio, Texas
Having been in a wreck wearing a modular full face, feeling and seeing first hand the damage to the front, side and back of the helmet, I assure you a FF or modular FF works better than not. I would not have walked away with the minor insignificant injuries I had if I had worn any other type helmet. I had road rash (relatively minor), bruises and contusions, and some compressed vertebrae. The helmet prevented the loss of my nose, jaw and probably my life. I do not always wear ATGATT but a Neotec Modular is always on.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 10,277
Likes: 7,756
From: West Central FL
Nah, don't want to expell that much life time to read all that. I'll continue to wear the half helmet in the summer to stay cool and the FF in the winter to stay warm.
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Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,348
Likes: 647
From: Vegas, baby!
In these FF helmet threads, we see who's had facial injuries from impact with pavement or another vehicle, and who hasn't. I have, and I usually wear a FF helmet. My Shoei RF1200 provides more peripheral vision than the first Bell FF that I bought in '85. All that means is that I have to turn my head a bit less when I look over my shoulder before changing lanes.
My off road helmet is also a FF, which means that I no longer have to wear a mouth guard when I'm dirt biking. IMO, the advantages of a FF helmet far outweigh any disadvantages.
My off road helmet is also a FF, which means that I no longer have to wear a mouth guard when I'm dirt biking. IMO, the advantages of a FF helmet far outweigh any disadvantages.
