Help me understand engines
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 5,900
Likes: 11,342
From: NE Ohio
zaccally
I don't understand why there's not room in the showroom for both.
The Big Twin's not going anywhere as long as there's a market for it
so they're making a Harley that's not "your daddy's Harley" too
so what?
I get it might not be someone's cup-o-tea, but I don't understand the hate or resistance to additional offerings
...L.T.A.
I don't understand why there's not room in the showroom for both.
The Big Twin's not going anywhere as long as there's a market for it
so they're making a Harley that's not "your daddy's Harley" too
so what?
I get it might not be someone's cup-o-tea, but I don't understand the hate or resistance to additional offerings
...L.T.A.
Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 16,271
Likes: 15,108
From: Somewhere SW
zaccally
I don't understand why there's not room in the showroom for both.
The Big Twin's not going anywhere as long as there's a market for it
so they're making a Harley that's not "your daddy's Harley" too
so what?
I get it might not be someone's cup-o-tea, but I don't understand the hate or resistance to additional offerings
...L.T.A.
I don't understand why there's not room in the showroom for both.
The Big Twin's not going anywhere as long as there's a market for it
so they're making a Harley that's not "your daddy's Harley" too
so what?
I get it might not be someone's cup-o-tea, but I don't understand the hate or resistance to additional offerings
...L.T.A.
My point is simple, if someone wants a foreign/import bike they can buy one. Why change a unique product to be like the rest?
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 2,809
Likes: 4,209
From: NC
I don't think MoCo top floor guys and engineers are limited to V twins for the future. They have the expertise and money to build an inline 4 or V4. As they deal with increasing Fed regulations and attracting a new generation of riders, I don't think they stay in the V twin box forever.
Heck, Ducati moved a couple of their flagship models from L Twin, desmo valves, trellis frame and SSSA to V4, spring valves, monocoque frame and DSSA. Certainly, Ducati purists were not happy. A company has to evolve to survive.
Heck, Ducati moved a couple of their flagship models from L Twin, desmo valves, trellis frame and SSSA to V4, spring valves, monocoque frame and DSSA. Certainly, Ducati purists were not happy. A company has to evolve to survive.
Last edited by tngarren; Sep 13, 2021 at 02:52 PM.
Road Master
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 798
Likes: 726
From: Moncton, NB
Another generation and you will be lucky to have the option of an internal combustion engine.
I will take a Revo Max in a touring frame any day. Just bump up the CC's and tune it for torque...
I will take a Revo Max in a touring frame any day. Just bump up the CC's and tune it for torque...
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 32,934
Likes: 36,032
From: Carlsbad, CA
I high reving engine, with torque at higher RPMs is not for a touring bike. Give it some more displacement, and longer stroke, and ya might be talking there.. ya gotta get the torque to kick in from the start.
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 3,741
Likes: 8,537
From: Bates County MO
Torque is the ability to do work. (how much rotational force is being applied, in an effort to achieve linear motion) Need a lot, to move heavy objects, from a stop. Bike + two humans + stuff = heavy.
Horsepower is the rate of acceleration, calculated as (torque * RPM)/5252.
Power to weight ratio controls what powertrain is appropriate for which platform.
As an example - you can put a 1000 horsepower (@ 15,000 RPM) Renault F1 engine in a earth mover dump truck, and it will shred clutches long before it starts to move- too much weight for the powertrain chosen. By the same token, you can put a 2500 foot pound torque @ 1000 RPM Caterpillar diesel engine in a Formula 1 chassis, and all it will do is break the frame.
Profit controls what goes into production. The V-Rod was a very powerful platform, and near indestructible- didn't sell well enough to continue production. Same with the Buell line of bikes- between the poor sales, and the average of $1500 worth of recalls per bike, HD never made a profit off of that line. Traditional platforms give way to EPA/TUV approved ones.
Since no one has a crystal ball, they have to produce what is currently selling (still gotta pay them bills), while trying different things- the PA and the new Sportster S are current examples of an attempt to reach out to new riders.
I hope the MOCO is successful, because their product has brought me many experiences, and enriched my time on this planet.
Horsepower is the rate of acceleration, calculated as (torque * RPM)/5252.
Power to weight ratio controls what powertrain is appropriate for which platform.
As an example - you can put a 1000 horsepower (@ 15,000 RPM) Renault F1 engine in a earth mover dump truck, and it will shred clutches long before it starts to move- too much weight for the powertrain chosen. By the same token, you can put a 2500 foot pound torque @ 1000 RPM Caterpillar diesel engine in a Formula 1 chassis, and all it will do is break the frame.
Profit controls what goes into production. The V-Rod was a very powerful platform, and near indestructible- didn't sell well enough to continue production. Same with the Buell line of bikes- between the poor sales, and the average of $1500 worth of recalls per bike, HD never made a profit off of that line. Traditional platforms give way to EPA/TUV approved ones.
Since no one has a crystal ball, they have to produce what is currently selling (still gotta pay them bills), while trying different things- the PA and the new Sportster S are current examples of an attempt to reach out to new riders.
I hope the MOCO is successful, because their product has brought me many experiences, and enriched my time on this planet.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 35,239
Likes: 19,070
From: 40.2444° N, 75.6419° W
The question whether or not it's a Harley engine. I think the Rev is designed on built by HD but the V-Rod had engines designed and built(?) by Porsche.
My point is simple, if someone wants a foreign/import bike they can buy one. Why change a unique product to be like the rest?
My point is simple, if someone wants a foreign/import bike they can buy one. Why change a unique product to be like the rest?
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I think it's a cool engine and I'm happy with my M8.
I get a kick out of the people that complain the Harley is the same bike being sold at modern prices, then scoff at new technology they're trying out in an effort to step it up. At the end of the day, I just want the company to succeed so I can continue enjoying the machines.
I get a kick out of the people that complain the Harley is the same bike being sold at modern prices, then scoff at new technology they're trying out in an effort to step it up. At the end of the day, I just want the company to succeed so I can continue enjoying the machines.
