ECM auto adjust to Stage 1 changes?
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Novice
Joined: Jul 2007
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ECM auto adjust to Stage 1 changes?
In the October 2008 American Iron on page 165 it is stated that the 2007 and later ECM units will use information from the exhaust sensors to maintain the proper air to fuel ratio if you change the air cleaner and exhaust. This means no fuel compensator like a Fuel Pak is needed. Can anyone confirm or deny this from experience?
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 2,609
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From: Indy area
Yes. From experience I can confirm they are wrong. Driveability issues rear their ugly heads very quickly, and decisively, if you try to do that.
Their primary purpose for even existing is to make a living selling advertisements and associated products via the articles praising them.
Our O2-sensor-equipped bikes indeed have a form of autotuning. But the way it works is to autotune the programmed-for parts to varying conditions in which they interoperate. Not to autotune for non-programmed-for parts. The effects can actually be the opposite of what is needed in that case.
Don't believe it for a minute. Okay? I'm not trying to sell you one cotton-picking thing.
Their primary purpose for even existing is to make a living selling advertisements and associated products via the articles praising them.
Our O2-sensor-equipped bikes indeed have a form of autotuning. But the way it works is to autotune the programmed-for parts to varying conditions in which they interoperate. Not to autotune for non-programmed-for parts. The effects can actually be the opposite of what is needed in that case.
Don't believe it for a minute. Okay? I'm not trying to sell you one cotton-picking thing.
Tourer
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 417
Likes: 3
From: CT
The 02 sensors are trying to keep the bike at an emissions friendly lean 14.7-15.1 air ratio.
way too lean for a happy motor in my opinion.
Even if they did auto tune, why would you want it to tune to a lean condition?
These air cooled motors are not built to run lean, they like gas!
Listen to Glens, he knows his stuff.
way too lean for a happy motor in my opinion.
Even if they did auto tune, why would you want it to tune to a lean condition?
These air cooled motors are not built to run lean, they like gas!
Listen to Glens, he knows his stuff.
Road Warrior
Joined: Mar 2008
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€Lil Thanks for the tip. However 176MV003 is for Cal ID Big Twin -2008 while there is a separate column for 2008 Touring models where it says n.a.. I will contact HD about it.
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Cruiser
Joined: Jul 2008
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From: CT
Oxygen sensors are designed to monitor the amount of unburned fuel to air ratio based on heat generated by the exhaust system.True they self tune the AFR but these set ups are primative to the technology of a car or truck..Years past the system was simple, one wire that created an AC signal and the sensor was grounded to the manifold when installed.These set ups are basically the same..they determine the AFR based on heat generated(the hotter the leaner) and constantly change from rich to lean in milliseconds..way to fast to see unless using an osilliscope to watch the wave form..BUT they all need a reference point to go by..When the engine just sits and idles the exhaust cools off somewhat an puts the O2 sensor in what is called OPEN LOOP..at this point the engine is running from a program only(what is installed into the ecm software)when it gets hot enough it switches to CLOSED LOOP this is where self tunning comes in..now the engine is running "ON ITS OWN"...BUT IT IS LIMITED AS TO HOW FAR IT VARIES FROM 14.7:1 which is where they set these bikes to run.A tunner changes the programs and can change the refernce to 13.8:1 or what ever your needs are..Now the engine is always tring to obtain the new setting(s)..Heated Oxygen Sensors are always in closed loop after an initial heat up process some where around 30-60 seconds and stays in closed loop all the time..much better technology, wider AFR's better performance,fuel mileage.I think as the years creep up on us they will be changing to Heated Oxygen Sensors for better performance all around which is why you can purchase the tunners with wide band o2 sensors..
Banned
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 703
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o2 senors, which I like to call engine performance inhibitors.All they are is harley davidsons answer to federal epa regulations and they are what are making the new bikes overheat,Of course this is just my opinion but its just has good an answer that you would most likely get at the stealer,I got rid of my sensors on my 06 bob and have beenhappy ever since
