An oil thread is by it's nature something that brings emotion into play. I remember when I first shared that paper with even the folks which had contributed monetarily and the discussion was less than smooth. Everyone wants to believe their flavor of Kool-Aid is the best. Not only that, everyone wants to believe the money they spent was spent correctly, to the point that they take exception to others that share a dissenting view. It's almost like if I say I use Redline and you use Amsoil, that I'm telling you that you're stupid - how silly is that?

I have a bike in my garage that's 40 model years old. That bike lasted this long, being ridden reasonably often, with whatever was sold on the shelf at the local gas getting place. Harley-Davidson's are about the lowest-tech engines I can think of in regular production today so not much is going to make a difference other than NOT using oil, not keeping that oil clean, or not changing that oil when it needs it.

The issue with Amsoil's tests (as I hinted at above) is not that they lie, but that they represent something that we don't need or can't use. We can't guarantee fresh oil all the time, nor is that even reasonable considering they suggest you can use extended drain intervals. They also use testing methods which are unconventional in the industry at best, at worst they have little to do with what goes on in your engine. That all being said, yeah, the oil (Amsoil) does do pretty good on standard tests. Why not settle for that and then stand on the service of it's dealers I wonder? I know I pay a lot more for service in all other areas of my life. I could spend a little more on oil if it wasn't for the shuck and jive part.

Anyhow, I'm not being (intentionally) arrogant so much as just throwing out a quick answer in the above messages - in which I think you misunderstood my brevity for arrogance. Sorry about that. Whenever someone sends me an email I think is negative in some way I re-read it (sometimes out loud) purposefully in a way that reduces or eliminates that - because 9 times out of 10 that's what people meant in the first place. With the exception of the learned scholar "brihvac" above, most people aren't out to start a fight.

 

Many folks. The sources are in the document as well.

 

Ever wonder why Amsoil spends so much money on advertising if their product is said to be so good?

It seems as though the product would sell itself and we wouldn't have to wade through the endless amsoil pushers on all the forums.

Truth be known that any one of these amsoil pushers that had their bike's oil changed without them knowing it from amsoil to brand X, wouldn't be able to tell the difference.

 

Oh yeah? Well as far as I'm concerned, it ain't valid untill the Duke says it is.

What Duke? The Duke of Earl, of course!

[IMG]local://upfiles/3789/64C63E759CD3456E98C6E36D22824B99.jpg[/IMG]
Earl, Duke of, One each.

 

glide,I dont really see that much advertising for amsoil. I ve seen more mobil oil commericals .I think most of there advertising is by word of mouth, becaused they tuned into a market where people or obsessed with using a product that is percieved to be the best. amsoil made oils for cars and trucks long before getting into the motorcycle market.I'll bet they didnt think it would take off like it did. thanks to the internet they became the standard everyone else is measured up to. plus they gave the users a chance to make a buck selling their product. my only beef with it all is that you'd think it would be easier to get. its not on every street corner.i've tried it and it worked fine . cant say it worked better then mobil 1, or syn3,but it worked.I think its just a unique way of marketing a product. whether it does everything it claims to do is like religion, you can either believe it or not. and no I'm not a dealer/seller/marketer or in any retail bussiness. just a guy who gets a kick out of people that worry more about their motor oil then I ever thought of.,,,,

 

I am an AMSOIL Dealer but I could care less what oil you use in your motor. The one fact that nobody has mentioned is the fact that AMSOIL's tests where done using ASTM Federal Testing Standards. That means that anyone using those Standards can produce the SAME RESULTS. I know that doesn't mean squat to those that dislike AMSOIL, and there are plenty of them on this forum. The one thing I do know is that wether you are testing fluids or metals or what ever, you have to have a standard test and a baseline that doesn't move. There are many Federal Test Standards, SAE for hardware and ASTM for Fluids.

AMSOIL has no National Advertising Campaign. Never has and probably never will. They prefer to put there dollars into R&D and let the Dealers do the advertising. That appears to be where the rub comes in. There is good and bad Dealers/Sales people in every line of work. So use what you like. It is your hard earned dollar and you have a right to spend it anyway you want.

I just hate to see AMSOIL slammed all the time in these forums. Before getting involved with AMSOIL, I spent a lot of time investigating the company and, since becoming involved with AMSOIL as a Dealer, I have spent time in Superior WI with the corporate management. I can tell you that from Al Amatuzio SR and Al Junior down to the gals that take the orders, I have never met a finer group of folks. Integrity, work ethic, etc. All above reproach. Extremely rare in todays business world.

Thats my two cents worth. Mobil, Redline etc. They are all good oils. Syn3 is made by CITGO and it is not a true synthetic. I for one wouldn't buy anything that put money in Caesar Chavez's pocket. (My opinion)

( I should have my head examined for even writing this. Every time i do I get attacked by the AMSOIL haters but I have to defend what I believe to be the truth.)

Bear

 

What Mobil Oil has to say about the 4-ball wear test (emphasis mine) :
"The 4-ball wear test is a test designed to evaluate the performance of a gear oil. The 4-ball wear test is not included as a part of any industry-wide recognized engine oil specifications (e.g. ILSAC GF-4, API SM, or ACEA specifications). ExxonMobil does not regard this test as a useful indicator of engine oil performance."
(http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/...il_Claims.aspx)


Just out of curiosity, why does Amsoil tout the results of this test for their motor oil when it isn't an industry recognized standard? Are they the only ones using it for motor oil?

 

It's how they sell their product and "big cahuna", now you see what I meant in my post.

Bear
I don't think it's so much amsoil (the oil) that gets slammed on the forums, it's the way the dealers rant on and on about it and the infamous white sheets.
To listen to some, it will do everything including grow hair on a bald head
Just look at the title of this post!

 

What I found interesting is this excert from the article, which suggests that changing oil too often can be detrimental to your engine. I have heard this before elsewhere. Much of the other information in the article by LBussy I have found myself elsewhere, and it is what led to my choice in oils.

I am currently doing my own research on my choice of engine oil with the help of Blackstone Labs, in fact I sent of my first sample just recently and await results. I think this is the best way to determine if the oil of your choice is doing what you want. I have included the TBN analysis as it will help to determine if I can run my oil a little longer or should change it more often. As a starting point I am going with HD's recc'd 5000 mile change for the engine, 10,000 for the other areas.

LBussy
Thank you for a very interesting read.

WB

 

Amsoil BS test are not run with the same grades of oil. I would like to see the results with everyones top grade synthetic such as Spectro. I've used Amsoil before and quit when I saw little dark colored specs come out toward the end of the quart. I've talked to others that have seen the same thing and wonder if anyone here has.