collapsing lifters??? I NEED HELP YESTERDAY!!
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6th Gear
Joined: Jul 2007
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collapsing lifters??? I NEED HELP YESTERDAY!!
I have a 1981 FLH with the 1340 shovel on it that I am about to strap a bomb too. I have been working on this thing off and on for about 6 months now. I can crank the bike when cold it runs great sounds great, let it warm up and take off up the road on it and 4-6 miles into the journey it will start this god awful banging, every now and then it will quit for a second or two then come right back. so i turn around go back to the house of course now its running like ****, sputtering and not really wanting to take the gas. get to the house cut it off let it set for a minute or two fire it back up and it runs fine for a minute or two then starts that god awful racket again. heres a list of what I have done to try and find this thing:
heads and rocker boxes rebuilt
adjusted the lifters a million times in a million different ways
new plugs with different heat ranges 4 times
new rings
new coil
new wires
timing is set to factory specs
new lifters
carb was rebuilt too
Have checked the cam and it and bearings look good and are nice and tight
if you heard this thing you would swear the crank or one of the rods was getting ready to take a **** on me, but this thing comes and goes and I wouldnt think that a rod or crank would come and go would it???
I think it is coming from the back cylinder rocker box but everything looks normal in there. any help would be greatly appreciated and if your aroundspartanburg sc or charlotte nc drop by have a beer and tell me what the hell to do. thanks ahead of time
heads and rocker boxes rebuilt
adjusted the lifters a million times in a million different ways
new plugs with different heat ranges 4 times
new rings
new coil
new wires
timing is set to factory specs
new lifters
carb was rebuilt too
Have checked the cam and it and bearings look good and are nice and tight
if you heard this thing you would swear the crank or one of the rods was getting ready to take a **** on me, but this thing comes and goes and I wouldnt think that a rod or crank would come and go would it???
I think it is coming from the back cylinder rocker box but everything looks normal in there. any help would be greatly appreciated and if your aroundspartanburg sc or charlotte nc drop by have a beer and tell me what the hell to do. thanks ahead of time
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RE: collapsing lifters??? I NEED HELP YESTERDAY!!
If you don't get a good answer soon, come back to the thread and bump it up to the top of the list during the day. There aren't many folks on here this time of night. There are some guys on here that are a helluva lot more technically proficient than me. Someone will see it and reply with a better idea than mine. Just hang in there. Oh, and welcome to the forums.
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Joined: Oct 2005
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RE: collapsing lifters??? I NEED HELP YESTERDAY!!
It sounds like a hydraulic unit is bleeding down. To test the lifters, ride it until the noise starts. Shut it down. Pull the plugs so you can rotate the engine easier. Pull clips off front pushrod covers. Rotate engine until one of the valves is closed. Check to see if the pushrod on the closed valvehas any up and down movement. If it does, that unit is bad or not adjusted correct. If there is no play, move on to the next one. Then do the rear the same way. New lifters go bad too. Check the tappet screen and make sure it is clean also. The screen may be restricting oil flow. Good luck with it.
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Joined: Oct 2005
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From: Santa Klaus County, Cali
RE: collapsing lifters??? I NEED HELP YESTERDAY!!
nightstalker, couple of ideas....You haven't said if you are running solids or hydraulic lifters, but if running hydraulics, TDW's thoughts are dead on.
Another idea...are you running electronic ignition or points? If running points and condensor, what about the possibility of a bad condensor. The cheap import ones that are the buck-ninety-nine Earl Shieb specials are made in Mexico and are sh*t.Switch to Blue Streak or Accel. Cost more but less worry. Your timing can be dead on but if you've got a crappy set of points that are collapsing you could end up with the symptoms you are describing. AgainI suggest Blue Streak or Accel...cost more but less worry.
Another idea...are you running electronic ignition or points? If running points and condensor, what about the possibility of a bad condensor. The cheap import ones that are the buck-ninety-nine Earl Shieb specials are made in Mexico and are sh*t.Switch to Blue Streak or Accel. Cost more but less worry. Your timing can be dead on but if you've got a crappy set of points that are collapsing you could end up with the symptoms you are describing. AgainI suggest Blue Streak or Accel...cost more but less worry.
Cruiser
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 207
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RE: collapsing lifters??? I NEED HELP YESTERDAY!!
You may want to check for a bent push rod, also valve to valve guide clearance, if a valve is hanging open it will run like poo and make a hellof a noise, also the hyd. lifter will try to take up the slack andmake it veryhardfor the valve to reclose proper.( worked on a sportster once that would knock a push rod off after it was run hard, reamed a half thou.off the guide, problem fixed) you should be able to open the push rod covers when its doing it and see if you have a bad lifter. just a note, I have used a adjustable timing light to watch push rods. if you have or know someone that has one, remove the push rod covers, adjust the valves and start it up (it's going to make a little mess, but not that bad.) you can see if the push rod is doing funny things, move the timing adjustment on the light around if it's a valve train noise you should be able to find it. another thing, have you ever heard a bottom end noise on a V twin? it does not sound anything like a rod knock in a car. good luck and keep us posted.
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6th Gear
Joined: Jul 2007
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RE: collapsing lifters??? I NEED HELP YESTERDAY!!
I am running hydraulic lifters and electronic ignition...where is the tappet screen?? I have done the thing with checking them while they are hot, lol burned the hell of my hand a few times doing that....got a set of gloves after that. everything was good with the lifters still being pumped up.I havent checked the tappet screen yet because I have no idea where it is and my manual is hard to understand where they say it is.
also would a bottom endknock come and go like that??
also would a bottom endknock come and go like that??
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Joined: Oct 2005
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RE: collapsing lifters??? I NEED HELP YESTERDAY!!
Tappat screen is located between the rear lifter clock and the cam cover. It is also where some people install a pressue gauge. From the factory, it is a cap that takes a large screwdriver. Most times you will need a hand held impact tool to get it loose. There are tools made for this purpose, and one can be fabbed at home pretty easy if you can't get it out with the hand impact.Remove the cap, use needlenose pliers to grasp the screen and spring. Clean it and reinstall it. You should install a new o ring on the cap.
If a lower end is bad, it will knock all the time. A lower end knock make quite a different sound than a valve train related noise.
If a lower end is bad, it will knock all the time. A lower end knock make quite a different sound than a valve train related noise.
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Joined: May 2007
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From: New York
RE: collapsing lifters??? I NEED HELP YESTERDAY!!
Had the same problem with my 1980 FLT! Harley guys coule not adjust the lifters correctly. I was not about to buy new lifters, ( just to see if it helps ) I hate diagnosing a problem by changing parts untill you get it fixed! So, I bought the solid lifter conversion kit and put them in.
To adjust them I read the instructions that were supplied with the kit. By the way, did you put the rods in the right places, they are different legnths? I did the final adjustment as I used to do on my race cars. I removed the plugs and cranked the motor. As it was spinning I adjusted the pushrods till the tick was very faint. Now after about five minutes of running the lifters are silent. Huge improvement in performance. Good luck!
To adjust them I read the instructions that were supplied with the kit. By the way, did you put the rods in the right places, they are different legnths? I did the final adjustment as I used to do on my race cars. I removed the plugs and cranked the motor. As it was spinning I adjusted the pushrods till the tick was very faint. Now after about five minutes of running the lifters are silent. Huge improvement in performance. Good luck!