4 speed transmission rebuild Help
4 speed transmission rebuild Help
I may be getting in over my head but I am needing to rebuild my ratchet top 4 speed and replace the seals. It was leaking pretty bad from the main shaft oil seal and counter shaft oil seal. The guy I got the bike from said he had to rebuild the tranny because the old tranny case was cracked. He gave me a bunch of seals and gaskets that came in the kit. He must have reused the main shaft oil seal and counter shaft oil seal.
Well here is my first issue. I pulled the countershaft and I am pretty sure the needle bearing are loose in there. I can't get the counter shaft gear cluster out.
Issue two. Pulling the starter clutch hub. I don't really want to go buy a $200 puller right now. I am currently a student and don't have that kind of loose change.
I am currently going to a motorcycle school in central FL... I am sure people are already rolling their eyes. If there is anyone around that has been turning wrenches and would want to show me a thing or two I would love the help.
Also any other tips would be greatly appreciated. The manual I have isn't the easiest to follow for greenhorns like myself.
Thanks
Well here is my first issue. I pulled the countershaft and I am pretty sure the needle bearing are loose in there. I can't get the counter shaft gear cluster out.
Issue two. Pulling the starter clutch hub. I don't really want to go buy a $200 puller right now. I am currently a student and don't have that kind of loose change.
I am currently going to a motorcycle school in central FL... I am sure people are already rolling their eyes. If there is anyone around that has been turning wrenches and would want to show me a thing or two I would love the help.
Also any other tips would be greatly appreciated. The manual I have isn't the easiest to follow for greenhorns like myself.
Thanks
Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 161
Likes: 7
From: Las Vegas
Since, I am pretty much in the middle of doing the same thing you are I can share a few tips with you...
"Buy the tools" & the HD Manual if you have not done so already...
The Clymer & Haynes are worthless IMHO; although I have been greatly disappointed in the HD one too at times...
You will end up spending more in the long run by not buying the right tools to begin with...
So if you don't have the dough now... wait ... it will be worth the price of admission...
The only tool I could not find for any price was the "Starter Clutch Puller HD-95650-42" and "Jims" is currently out of stock with no ETA...
I did some googling and found that IF you are careful you can use a two-finger or three finger puller as a substitute; you can buy them cheap or you can rent one from autozone and get 100% of your money back when your done...
hard to beat that for cost...
I had no trouble with the substitute puller...
The HD manual says pull the counter shaft first and the counter shaft gear does have two needle bearings in it...
IF you are following the HD manual and you have a pick/scribe/coat hanger or whatever you should be able to fish the counter shaft washer out and bump the whole assembly out with a small piece of wood or something...
Search ebay for "Shovelhead Panhead spacer o-ring leak free transmission" sellers handle is "saddlebagrail" he sells the fix for the built-in-oil leak from HD... about $45.00 bucks to your front door
This video shows you how to DIY or what you need to pay somebody to do... if you don't want to buy it from saddlebagrail
You probably need to replace the spacer anyway, may as well fix it good...
Haste makes waste... and lack of patience will cost you dough...
"Buy the tools" & the HD Manual if you have not done so already...
The Clymer & Haynes are worthless IMHO; although I have been greatly disappointed in the HD one too at times...
You will end up spending more in the long run by not buying the right tools to begin with...
So if you don't have the dough now... wait ... it will be worth the price of admission...
The only tool I could not find for any price was the "Starter Clutch Puller HD-95650-42" and "Jims" is currently out of stock with no ETA...
I did some googling and found that IF you are careful you can use a two-finger or three finger puller as a substitute; you can buy them cheap or you can rent one from autozone and get 100% of your money back when your done...
hard to beat that for cost...
I had no trouble with the substitute puller...
The HD manual says pull the counter shaft first and the counter shaft gear does have two needle bearings in it...
IF you are following the HD manual and you have a pick/scribe/coat hanger or whatever you should be able to fish the counter shaft washer out and bump the whole assembly out with a small piece of wood or something...
Search ebay for "Shovelhead Panhead spacer o-ring leak free transmission" sellers handle is "saddlebagrail" he sells the fix for the built-in-oil leak from HD... about $45.00 bucks to your front door
This video shows you how to DIY or what you need to pay somebody to do... if you don't want to buy it from saddlebagrail
You probably need to replace the spacer anyway, may as well fix it good...
Haste makes waste... and lack of patience will cost you dough...
Last edited by Bohemian; Dec 4, 2012 at 11:54 PM.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 7,488
Likes: 3,687
From: Santa Klaus County, Cali
I may be getting in over my head but I am needing to rebuild my ratchet top 4 speed and replace the seals. It was leaking pretty bad from the main shaft oil seal and counter shaft oil seal. The guy I got the bike from said he had to rebuild the tranny because the old tranny case was cracked. He gave me a bunch of seals and gaskets that came in the kit. He must have reused the main shaft oil seal and counter shaft oil seal.
Well here is my first issue. I pulled the countershaft and I am pretty sure the needle bearing are loose in there. I can't get the counter shaft gear cluster out.
Issue two. Pulling the starter clutch hub. I don't really want to go buy a $200 puller right now. I am currently a student and don't have that kind of loose change.
I am currently going to a motorcycle school in central FL... I am sure people are already rolling their eyes. If there is anyone around that has been turning wrenches and would want to show me a thing or two I would love the help.
Also any other tips would be greatly appreciated. The manual I have isn't the easiest to follow for greenhorns like myself.
Thanks
Well here is my first issue. I pulled the countershaft and I am pretty sure the needle bearing are loose in there. I can't get the counter shaft gear cluster out.
Issue two. Pulling the starter clutch hub. I don't really want to go buy a $200 puller right now. I am currently a student and don't have that kind of loose change.
I am currently going to a motorcycle school in central FL... I am sure people are already rolling their eyes. If there is anyone around that has been turning wrenches and would want to show me a thing or two I would love the help.
Also any other tips would be greatly appreciated. The manual I have isn't the easiest to follow for greenhorns like myself.
Thanks
As has been mentioned...OEM manual and parts book are a "must have". Harbor Freight sells cheap tools at a cheap price. Another place for decent priced s tuff is Enco.
The tool you will definitely need is the Adjusting Shifter Gauge in order to align the shift drum and shifter clutch/gears. You may think you can eyeball for center-to-center but most likely you won't which means you put it all back together, run it and do not grab all gears, which means you take it all apart again because you did not do it correctly the firts time because you figured you could go without it. Either you buy it, borrow it, or take it someplace and have them check to make sure it is within specs...which means someone else is doing your work, and if I don't trust them with my life the partciular motor work gets done by me and doesn't get farmed out. Last thing you need is to be stuck on a long stretch of lonesome because someone did a $hitty job on your rebuild.
Club Member
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 66,106
Likes: 51,387
From: Niles Canyon Ca.
If you have the countershaft out those gears are all loose in the box. Are you sure they didn't just sink into place on top of the mainshaft gears and are a bit jammed in there? Flip the box over and see if the gears will fall out along with rollers spacers and such.
As has been mentioned...OEM manual and parts book are a "must have". Harbor Freight sells cheap tools at a cheap price. Another place for decent priced s tuff is Enco.
The tool you will definitely need is the Adjusting Shifter Gauge in order to align the shift drum and shifter clutch/gears. You may think you can eyeball for center-to-center but most likely you won't which means you put it all back together, run it and do not grab all gears, which means you take it all apart again because you did not do it correctly the firts time because you figured you could go without it. Either you buy it, borrow it, or take it someplace and have them check to make sure it is within specs...which means someone else is doing your work, and if I don't trust them with my life the partciular motor work gets done by me and doesn't get farmed out. Last thing you need is to be stuck on a long stretch of lonesome because someone did a $hitty job on your rebuild.
As has been mentioned...OEM manual and parts book are a "must have". Harbor Freight sells cheap tools at a cheap price. Another place for decent priced s tuff is Enco.
The tool you will definitely need is the Adjusting Shifter Gauge in order to align the shift drum and shifter clutch/gears. You may think you can eyeball for center-to-center but most likely you won't which means you put it all back together, run it and do not grab all gears, which means you take it all apart again because you did not do it correctly the firts time because you figured you could go without it. Either you buy it, borrow it, or take it someplace and have them check to make sure it is within specs...which means someone else is doing your work, and if I don't trust them with my life the partciular motor work gets done by me and doesn't get farmed out. Last thing you need is to be stuck on a long stretch of lonesome because someone did a $hitty job on your rebuild.
Here's a little tip on that unless you change the shifting forks themselves or change out the entire ratchet lid the new gears & shift dogs will go in and not need any adjusting 99% of the time , you've got some wiggle room with the old 4 speeds .
The poor mans way to do it and it takes a little time and some common sense is assemble the gears in the box leave it dry the gently put the lid on and find neutral , spin the mainshaft a few times to roll everything inside over several turns . Now gently work the top straight up and peek inside at the shift dogs , they should be both centered up pretty well , if so your usually good to go . But for a novice I would repeat the procedure and shift it into first gears , turn the mainshaft a few times and lift the top straight up again and see how the shift dog is engaging in the gear . Do this for 1st through 4 th . If any of the dogs don't look like they are seating all the way , take it to a local Indy and have them set by a pro , you'll be money ahead trust me .
Another question. The needle bearings in a 74 are loose. Can you change them out for the caged needle bearing that they changed to in 76? Or should I just stay with the loose needles. Another thing, they all got mixed up. Rookie mistake. I read you should separate all 3 sets of bearing or does it really not matter that much?
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Club Member
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 66,106
Likes: 51,387
From: Niles Canyon Ca.
To change it out to the later caged bearing style you really need to know what your doing , it involves replacing the counter shaft and the counter shaft case bushings to the later year also and picking up a complete shim pack to set the end play on the gear cluster , what get hairy is there is like 3 different sizes & configurations over the years . Best to to just pick new loose bearings they are cheap enough , but I would mic a few to find what size they are . They do come in .0001" and up over size , this is where the factory manual is your bible .
I've done the same as you and mixed them before but I did mic everything so all the sizes where the same per side & went back accordingly .
I've done the same as you and mixed them before but I did mic everything so all the sizes where the same per side & went back accordingly .
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Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 12,878
Likes: 5,449
From: la la land jerzey
the post is 2 years old - if you need help with a trans issue or adjustment issues - start a new post the guys will help
