HD generic stage one upgrade to Fatboy? Good idea?
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Stellar HDF Member
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 2,486
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From: Huntington Beach, CA
HD generic stage one upgrade to Fatboy? Good idea?
I have my 2015 Fatboy pretty much set up the way I want it excepting that I have deliberately held off on messing with the exhaust setup.
Now that the bike is otherwise set up, I am looking at doing a fairly banal all-HD exhaust upgrade. Contemplating the Screaming Eagle slip ons, an air cooler, and I guess they have to re-map the system to accommodate these changes?
I am not especially interested in more sound -- mainly interested in improving the engine by getting more air in and out of the engine to be kinder to it and maybe get a bit more performance, although I have to say I am pretty happy with the 103 engine performance right now.
So query: is this worth doing?
Now that the bike is otherwise set up, I am looking at doing a fairly banal all-HD exhaust upgrade. Contemplating the Screaming Eagle slip ons, an air cooler, and I guess they have to re-map the system to accommodate these changes?
I am not especially interested in more sound -- mainly interested in improving the engine by getting more air in and out of the engine to be kinder to it and maybe get a bit more performance, although I have to say I am pretty happy with the 103 engine performance right now.
So query: is this worth doing?
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 100,455
Likes: 19,811
From: Centennial, CO
Yes, worth it. I don't think it necessary for a re-map, the newer EFI systems are more self-adjusting than older systems. If you get convinced otherwise, DO NOT go to your dealer for it.
Road Warrior
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 1,626
Likes: 310
From: "Old Hangtown" Placerville Ca.
Yes, well worth the $1k approx. There would be a noticeable improvement in performance and sound. You can have the dealer download a new map if they do the mod (not recommended) or buy a tuner for a couple hundred more and do it yourself, then you have it if you do any other mods or want to tune it yourself.. I have an Vance and Hines Fp3, simple to use, works great.
Last edited by Rocker B; Oct 27, 2015 at 01:06 AM.
Club Member
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 11,467
Likes: 3,569
From: Idaho
There are four potential reasons for doing a "Stage 1" upgrade:
1. Increased horsepower and torque.
2. Reduced heat because of removing the catalytic converters.
3. Better sound. (Doesn't have to be louder in order to sound "better".)
4. Retuning the engine in order to both accomodate the above changes, and to allow the motor to run as well as the design engineers know it can run by no longer restricting it to EPA compliance.
So, make sure the new slipons don't have cats in them.
There is absolutely no reason not to have the dealer do the tune, as long as you know that your local dealer is competent. However, here's the kicker: Do NOT just let them do a "download" in order to save the money by not buying a tuning module. The dealer download will restore your bike and its new parts to an EPA compliant tune. You'll lose a lot of the advantages of doing the Stage 1 in the first place.
I don't have a dog in this hunt, so I'm not going to push one tuner over the other, whether you go with HD SEPST, TTS, PV, or whatever. All have their positives and negatives. Just make sure you get a reflash or remap or smart tune or whatever, done by somebody who knows what they're doing.
To answer your question, yes, it absolutely is worth doing, even if you're not some hotrodder. The motor will run cooler, it will run happier, and it will have a lot more pull away from a stop or when passing on the highway, and it'll sound better as well.
I'm sure gonna do one on my new bike!
1. Increased horsepower and torque.
2. Reduced heat because of removing the catalytic converters.
3. Better sound. (Doesn't have to be louder in order to sound "better".)
4. Retuning the engine in order to both accomodate the above changes, and to allow the motor to run as well as the design engineers know it can run by no longer restricting it to EPA compliance.
So, make sure the new slipons don't have cats in them.
There is absolutely no reason not to have the dealer do the tune, as long as you know that your local dealer is competent. However, here's the kicker: Do NOT just let them do a "download" in order to save the money by not buying a tuning module. The dealer download will restore your bike and its new parts to an EPA compliant tune. You'll lose a lot of the advantages of doing the Stage 1 in the first place.
I don't have a dog in this hunt, so I'm not going to push one tuner over the other, whether you go with HD SEPST, TTS, PV, or whatever. All have their positives and negatives. Just make sure you get a reflash or remap or smart tune or whatever, done by somebody who knows what they're doing.
To answer your question, yes, it absolutely is worth doing, even if you're not some hotrodder. The motor will run cooler, it will run happier, and it will have a lot more pull away from a stop or when passing on the highway, and it'll sound better as well.
I'm sure gonna do one on my new bike!
Last edited by IdahoHacker; Oct 25, 2015 at 12:07 PM.
I have my 2015 Fatboy pretty much set up the way I want it excepting that I have deliberately held off on messing with the exhaust setup.
Now that the bike is otherwise set up, I am looking at doing a fairly banal all-HD exhaust upgrade. Contemplating the Screaming Eagle slip ons, an air cooler, and I guess they have to re-map the system to accommodate these changes?
I am not especially interested in more sound -- mainly interested in improving the engine by getting more air in and out of the engine to be kinder to it and maybe get a bit more performance, although I have to say I am pretty happy with the 103 engine performance right now.
So query: is this worth doing?
Now that the bike is otherwise set up, I am looking at doing a fairly banal all-HD exhaust upgrade. Contemplating the Screaming Eagle slip ons, an air cooler, and I guess they have to re-map the system to accommodate these changes?
I am not especially interested in more sound -- mainly interested in improving the engine by getting more air in and out of the engine to be kinder to it and maybe get a bit more performance, although I have to say I am pretty happy with the 103 engine performance right now.
So query: is this worth doing?
Here is a link to an informative overview of Stage I Upgrades. LINK
Since you are happy with the performance, and are looking for more of the Harley sound, there is a very inexpensive mod you can do. You may be very pleased with it, and stop there. If you decide to go for more performance later, this mod will work well with whatever you choose to do in the future.
Take a look at the two vids below. They will give you a good sound, cost hardly anything, and will increase performance some.
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Road Master
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 789
Likes: 4
From: Utah
Just my opinion, but I don't think there is ever enough of a power increase from a stage 1 to really notice much while riding a bike. That being said, I would do a stage 1 on any bike I owned for looks alone. I think the stock pipes and air cleaners on all Harley's are ugly. And stock pipes sound too wimpy for my taste as well.
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Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2012
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From: Columbus, OH
IMO retuning is the best part of the stage one. I remember reading on here somewhere recently that a member (SLV I believe) used a Power Vision and retuned a completely stock bike and reported an improvement. There are many who will argue against a tuner and especially a dyno tune when doing a stage one but the main function of tuning is to give the bike what it needs or I prefer to look at it as optimizing the air fuel mixture across the board. Benefits of this are engine efficiency, better fuel economy, improved throttle response and a cooler running engine.
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Thread Starter
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Stellar HDF Member
Joined: May 2014
Posts: 2,486
Likes: 695
From: Huntington Beach, CA
IMO retuning is the best part of the stage one. I remember reading on here somewhere recently that a member (SLV I believe) used a Power Vision and retuned a completely stock bike and reported an improvement. There are many who will argue against a tuner and especially a dyno tune when doing a stage one but the main function of tuning is to give the bike what it needs or I prefer to look at it as optimizing the air fuel mixture across the board. Benefits of this are engine efficiency, better fuel economy, improved throttle response and a cooler running engine.
Club Member
Joined: Jul 2014
Posts: 11,467
Likes: 3,569
From: Idaho
IMO retuning is the best part of the stage one. I remember reading on here somewhere recently that a member (SLV I believe) used a Power Vision and retuned a completely stock bike and reported an improvement. There are many who will argue against a tuner and especially a dyno tune when doing a stage one but the main function of tuning is to give the bike what it needs or I prefer to look at it as optimizing the air fuel mixture across the board. Benefits of this are engine efficiency, better fuel economy, improved throttle response and a cooler running engine.
I had my 2014 FXDC smart tuned using a SEPST. Just for ***** & giggles, I actually had a before & after dyno pull done.
I got a solid 2-3 ft-lbs of torque between 2,000 and 3,500 rpm. The throttle response was noticeably snappier. I had a motor officer ride it, and even he noticed it. The sound got better, more rappier, rpm ramped up quicker when the throttle was twisted, and I routinely got 50-52 mpg on the road.
Best of all, the butt-dyno was better when pulling away from a stop.
Bottom line, it helped the stock bike run the best way it could, instead of the way the EPA demands it run. Two thumbs up from me.
Important note: If you put a freer flowing air cleaner and exhaust on your motor, the ECM and narrow-band O2 sensors can NOT fully accommodate the change. Period.
Last edited by IdahoHacker; Oct 26, 2015 at 01:02 PM.
