When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
My car is a 1981 model. My bike is a 1995 model. I suspect neither one is ethanol friendly.
Regardless of the cooling effect of the ethanol, it still contains less energy (BTU's). I suspect that gains from the cooling effect are not enough to offset the reduced BTU's.
I used to have a 2007 Jeep Wrangler. It had a harder time towing my trailer when running 10% ethanol. It also got 3 to 4 mpg worse fuel economy. It also felt like it accelerated slower with ethanol. I got of that Jeep but it had nothing to do with ethanol.
agreed.
Using a quality fuel stabilizer will keep the alcohol from absorbing moisture from the atmosphere, which will allow for proper combustion and maintain better performance and engine longevity.
You are correct on the fuel stabilizer being a good thing, but it is actually for a completely different reason....
This pic, borrowed from earlier in this thread from RacerKVN,
Shows the polymer that forms from some of the dregs out of the bottom end of an Ethylene plant. The stabilizer has a killer for the reaction that makes this stuff form out of the chemicals in the dregs. I used it for years in a "dregs" unit in Dow, in the Butadiene plant. It works like magic in microscopic amounts. Keep it in there. It is great for preventing that from happening.
But in short, I will if not by the very least would like to point out that in 2012, a study by Auto Alliance showed that some cars (model years 2001 to 2009) showed internal engine damage as the result of using an ethanol fuel blend.
Damage to the valves and valve seats was evident in some of the cars tested.
This was a test of E-15, not E-10. After the equivalent of 100,000 miles, two of 16 engines showed valve and valve seat damage, (which would probably be associated with running lean).
As I mentioned in post #47, there could be some issues with E-15, because the extra volume of fuel required may exceed the range in which the ECM can self-adjust, so a tune or re-mapping may be required to avoid running lean.
You are correct on the fuel stabilizer being a good thing, but it is actually for a completely different reason....
This pic, borrowed from earlier in this thread from RacerKVN,
Shows the polymer that forms from some of the dregs out of the bottom end of an Ethylene plant. The stabilizer has a killer for the reaction that makes this stuff form out of the chemicals in the dregs. I used it for years in a "dregs" unit in Dow, in the Butadiene plant. It works like magic in microscopic amounts. Keep it in there. It is great for preventing that from happening.
Okay, thanks. But I musta missed that photo. Curious about some of the terms you used for identifying these compounds ie; "dregs" "polymer"... By dregs, you must be referring to the strands wrapped around the kernels in corn? And the polymer is what develops in what part of the engine due to the chemical decomposition of ethanol?
Please explain... First I've heard of this and yes! If I plan on leaving a motor parked for any length of time, like yard equipment for instance, I add fuel stabilizers always.
This was a test of E-15, not E-10. After the equivalent of 100,000 miles, two of 16 engines showed valve and valve seat damage, (which would probably be associated with running lean).
As I mentioned in post #47, there could be some issues with E-15, because the extra volume of fuel required may exceed the range in which the ECM can self-adjust, so a tune or re-mapping may be required to avoid running lean.
Busted!!
Should have noted I paraphrased some quotes from this article; http://auto.howstuffworks.com/fuel-e...ge-engine1.htm
I'm not a scholar of chemical science and will admit to knowing about as much in relations to the combustion engines. Why the internet these days is as about as good a source as our encyclopedias once were for gathering info on factual matter.
Had it not been for the interned, there be many more motorists stranded than we usually see due to faulty engine components.
Okay, thanks. But I musta missed that photo. Curious about some of the terms you used for identifying these compounds ie; "dregs" "polymer"... By dregs, you must be referring to the strands wrapped around the kernels in corn? And the polymer is what develops in what part of the engine due to the chemical decomposition of ethanol?
Please explain... First I've heard of this and yes! If I plan on leaving a motor parked for any length of time, like yard equipment for instance, I add fuel stabilizers always.
This residue is from the gasoline component of the fuel deteriorating, not the ethanol. Ethanol itself is quite stable. For instance, you won't notice stuff like that appearing in old bottles of booze.
In fact, I happen to have 25-year-old containers of ethanol (purchased for industrial use) which are still perfectly clear, with zero debris. And when this alcohol evaporates, it doesn't leave any gum or varnish, like gasoline does.
"Longplay" mentioned that the dregs came from an ethylene plant, not an ethanol plant. These are two very different things, with most ethylene coming from the refining of petrochemicals.
Last edited by Warp Factor; Aug 6, 2016 at 07:06 AM.
Okay, thanks. But I musta missed that photo. Curious about some of the terms you used for identifying these compounds ie; "dregs" "polymer"... By dregs, you must be referring to the strands wrapped around the kernels in corn? And the polymer is what develops in what part of the engine due to the chemical decomposition of ethanol?
Please explain... First I've heard of this and yes! If I plan on leaving a motor parked for any length of time, like yard equipment for instance, I add fuel stabilizers always.
By "dregs" I mean the chemical plant refines the raw product and takes out the parts that are not the chemical that they want. Those unwanted parts are "dregs". In the case of our gasoline, they are components that boil out of the stills, or distillation vessels, as heavy components around the boiling point of our gasoline. So, since they are unwanted, they pipe them out to the gasoline blending station area in the back of the refinery. They are very reactive when exposed to air, and form polymers when in contact with oxygen. Similar to the "gel" that forms in old diesel. But in the case of these chemicals, it does not stop at the gel stage, but goes on to a polymer very similar to the rubber that is of a similar color, that you see on the soles of some work boots.
I could give you all the chemical names, but this is already boring enough for this forum. I deal with these things daily, and have been working in the Ethylene and refining side of things for almost 45 years.
And, by the way, once that polymer is formed, it is not really very soluble in anything I can expect you to find. So the only fix is to disassemble and clean. A flush with some solvent is not going to help once it has formed up into beads like that.
Yes, and the ethanol has very little if anything to do with this fouling. But they are right, the ethanol has a slightly lower BTU content on burning in our cylinders than regular gasoline. But I would tell you, it is probably less than the 3 to 4 percent values I hear people talking about. It is hardly noticeable actually.
OK, sorry to get technical on this, but I do not know any other way to explain it.
7 Surprising Harley-Davidson Products that Are Not Motorcycles
Slideshow: The bar-and-shield logo shows up on far more than motorcycles, some of the company's most unexpected products have nothing to do with riding.
Slideshow: From the troubled AMF years to modern misfires, these bikes earned reputations for reliability issues, questionable engineering, or disappointing performance.
Crazy Bunderbike Build Looks Amazing, But Is It Impossible to Ride?
Slideshow: The Swiss custom shop has taken a Harley Softail and stretched it into something so long and low that it looks closer to a rolling sculpture than a conventional motorcycle.
Engraved Rebellion: Inside Bundnerbike's Glam Rock II
Slideshow: A standard cruiser becomes an intricate metal canvas in the hands of a Swiss custom house known for pushing Harley-Davidson platforms far beyond their factory brief.
Slideshow: Harley-Davidson's challenges aren't abstract; they show up in dropping shipments, shrinking dealer traffic, and strategic decisions that aren't yet translating into growth.
