need some cam advice
Thread Starter
|
Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 222
Likes: 1
From: Jacksonville, Fl
Thanks for the advice. Sounds like sticking with chain driven will be the easier/more cost effective option. Now on to which ones... I'm thinking Andrews because they seem to be reasonably priced. But 21? 26? 37?
I see "complete install kits" and I see the cams by themselves. If I were to buy the cams by themselves what all is needed for install? Again, I will be replacing the inner cam bearings and the lifters. What else?
I see "complete install kits" and I see the cams by themselves. If I were to buy the cams by themselves what all is needed for install? Again, I will be replacing the inner cam bearings and the lifters. What else?
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,006
Likes: 1,240
From: On the Front Range, CO
To do a full cam plate upgrade with roller chains front and back as well as hydraulic tensioners, plan to spend about $700, including the cam shafts. That's not including gaskets and adjustable pushrods.
I've been doing a bunch of research on this issue, as my Heritage Springer has ~22K miles.
I was going to go with the SE Hydraulic Cam Tensiorer upgrade kit, but it allows for retention of the stock cams. This is both good and bad.
The kit replaces the outer cam chain with a roller style chain, but as it retains the stock cams, or stock equivalent replacements, the Morse link style chain remains in place for the secondary cam chain (inner). This is the tensioner that wears faster.
If you go to a 06 Dyna or 07+ Softail cam support plate you can run a roller chain both internal and external. This means though, that you need to use conversion cams.
The inner cam bearing on the TC88 is a .875" journal. The outer bearing is the same.
When you bump up to the 06 Dyna or 07+ Softail cam plate, the outer bearing is now 1". The inner for these years is also 1".
Conversion cams have a .875" inner bearing journal and a 1" outer bearing journal. I don't plan on any motor work, so whereas an Andrews TW-21 is very favorable, the Andrews 21N is the conversion cam with differing bearing journals, and can be installed with roller chains front and back.
The SE upgrade kit maintains the original bearing sizes for the TC88. You want to do conversions. If you keep that inner roller chain, all you've done is upgraded your cams.
I've been doing a bunch of research on this issue, as my Heritage Springer has ~22K miles.
I was going to go with the SE Hydraulic Cam Tensiorer upgrade kit, but it allows for retention of the stock cams. This is both good and bad.
The kit replaces the outer cam chain with a roller style chain, but as it retains the stock cams, or stock equivalent replacements, the Morse link style chain remains in place for the secondary cam chain (inner). This is the tensioner that wears faster.
If you go to a 06 Dyna or 07+ Softail cam support plate you can run a roller chain both internal and external. This means though, that you need to use conversion cams.
The inner cam bearing on the TC88 is a .875" journal. The outer bearing is the same.
When you bump up to the 06 Dyna or 07+ Softail cam plate, the outer bearing is now 1". The inner for these years is also 1".
Conversion cams have a .875" inner bearing journal and a 1" outer bearing journal. I don't plan on any motor work, so whereas an Andrews TW-21 is very favorable, the Andrews 21N is the conversion cam with differing bearing journals, and can be installed with roller chains front and back.
The SE upgrade kit maintains the original bearing sizes for the TC88. You want to do conversions. If you keep that inner roller chain, all you've done is upgraded your cams.
Club Member
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 145,895
Likes: 821
From: 40 miles Northeast of Indy..
IN the 5 yrs I've been in here and yes I went thought the (what Cam to buy) and I have probably spent well over 500 hrs doing research and learning and still love to look up and help NEBIES..
I'll guarantee U that I've spent more time than U have trying to learn about Cams.
Still don't think I am close to being a Xpert on cams, but I think I know more than most..
First U have to say what/when/how do U want/need Ur cams for..
like,,, How do U ride,, solo, 2 up.. town or Hiway.. Do U want stoplight to stoplight or Low TQ..
Most of U (Nebies) ask and think that is really easy to just come in here and ask what the best is..
I've always said that their is no BEST of AnyThing...
BUT in cams, Anyone who gives an honest Opinion should at least know HOW U ride.......
IN Ur OP. U said U ride 3k to 5500 RPM's....
I"ll ASK,,, DO U REALLY ride at that RPM's..
That's an Average of 35mph in first,: 50mph in 2nd and almost 70 in 3rd.. SOOO tell Me,,, Is that REALLY what U DO.????
And How U ride""????
Cause if it is then U don't want a cam make for low-mid TQ and in IMO the Intake of 38* and the duration and overlap is not going to help in the upper RPMs.,, U need one that's made for Mid-High TQ..
Which U want/need a cam with a Intake closer of above 38*and above.
Trouble is a lot of NEBIES think they know what's going on, But, not true..
the SE 211's come on around 3 rpm and are really good cams in the 3-5k rps, even better if U increase the Compress a little in the 88's and 96''ers, but U need to make sure U heads, Comp, Pistons, all work together to get the most out of Ur build...
Bottom line is there's a lot of bolt in cams that meet the LOW-MID TQ wants of most riders in here,, but then U need to put in a Higher Revving, TQ making cams like the.
SE 211's
Andews 37'd
Cranes 316's
HQ 575's
RedShift557.
ECT
ECT
FROM LINKhttp://www.bigboyzcycles.com/tccams.htm
LOTS of cams that are Bolt in that will work....
.
.
I'll guarantee U that I've spent more time than U have trying to learn about Cams.
Still don't think I am close to being a Xpert on cams, but I think I know more than most..
First U have to say what/when/how do U want/need Ur cams for..
like,,, How do U ride,, solo, 2 up.. town or Hiway.. Do U want stoplight to stoplight or Low TQ..
Most of U (Nebies) ask and think that is really easy to just come in here and ask what the best is..
I've always said that their is no BEST of AnyThing...
BUT in cams, Anyone who gives an honest Opinion should at least know HOW U ride.......
IN Ur OP. U said U ride 3k to 5500 RPM's....
I"ll ASK,,, DO U REALLY ride at that RPM's..
That's an Average of 35mph in first,: 50mph in 2nd and almost 70 in 3rd.. SOOO tell Me,,, Is that REALLY what U DO.????
And How U ride""????
Cause if it is then U don't want a cam make for low-mid TQ and in IMO the Intake of 38* and the duration and overlap is not going to help in the upper RPMs.,, U need one that's made for Mid-High TQ..
Which U want/need a cam with a Intake closer of above 38*and above.
Trouble is a lot of NEBIES think they know what's going on, But, not true..
the SE 211's come on around 3 rpm and are really good cams in the 3-5k rps, even better if U increase the Compress a little in the 88's and 96''ers, but U need to make sure U heads, Comp, Pistons, all work together to get the most out of Ur build...
Bottom line is there's a lot of bolt in cams that meet the LOW-MID TQ wants of most riders in here,, but then U need to put in a Higher Revving, TQ making cams like the.
SE 211's
Andews 37'd
Cranes 316's
HQ 575's
RedShift557.
ECT
ECT
FROM LINKhttp://www.bigboyzcycles.com/tccams.htm
LOTS of cams that are Bolt in that will work....
.
.
Last edited by oct1949; Oct 19, 2012 at 02:34 PM.
Tourer
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 323
Likes: 18
From: Maryland
To do a full cam plate upgrade with roller chains front and back as well as hydraulic tensioners, plan to spend about $700, including the cam shafts. That's not including gaskets and adjustable pushrods.
I've been doing a bunch of research on this issue, as my Heritage Springer has ~22K miles.
I was going to go with the SE Hydraulic Cam Tensiorer upgrade kit, but it allows for retention of the stock cams. This is both good and bad.
The kit replaces the outer cam chain with a roller style chain, but as it retains the stock cams, or stock equivalent replacements, the Morse link style chain remains in place for the secondary cam chain (inner). This is the tensioner that wears faster.
If you go to a 06 Dyna or 07+ Softail cam support plate you can run a roller chain both internal and external. This means though, that you need to use conversion cams.
The inner cam bearing on the TC88 is a .875" journal. The outer bearing is the same.
When you bump up to the 06 Dyna or 07+ Softail cam plate, the outer bearing is now 1". The inner for these years is also 1".
Conversion cams have a .875" inner bearing journal and a 1" outer bearing journal. I don't plan on any motor work, so whereas an Andrews TW-21 is very favorable, the Andrews 21N is the conversion cam with differing bearing journals, and can be installed with roller chains front and back.
The SE upgrade kit maintains the original bearing sizes for the TC88. You want to do conversions. If you keep that inner roller chain, all you've done is upgraded your cams.
I've been doing a bunch of research on this issue, as my Heritage Springer has ~22K miles.
I was going to go with the SE Hydraulic Cam Tensiorer upgrade kit, but it allows for retention of the stock cams. This is both good and bad.
The kit replaces the outer cam chain with a roller style chain, but as it retains the stock cams, or stock equivalent replacements, the Morse link style chain remains in place for the secondary cam chain (inner). This is the tensioner that wears faster.
If you go to a 06 Dyna or 07+ Softail cam support plate you can run a roller chain both internal and external. This means though, that you need to use conversion cams.
The inner cam bearing on the TC88 is a .875" journal. The outer bearing is the same.
When you bump up to the 06 Dyna or 07+ Softail cam plate, the outer bearing is now 1". The inner for these years is also 1".
Conversion cams have a .875" inner bearing journal and a 1" outer bearing journal. I don't plan on any motor work, so whereas an Andrews TW-21 is very favorable, the Andrews 21N is the conversion cam with differing bearing journals, and can be installed with roller chains front and back.
The SE upgrade kit maintains the original bearing sizes for the TC88. You want to do conversions. If you keep that inner roller chain, all you've done is upgraded your cams.
Thanks so much for this info Redbeard!!! Exactly what I've been wondering ..how do I upgrade that camplate/tensioners AND the rear chain to a roller! No way I'm going to spend the time and $$ doing the upgrade and leave that Morse link style chain to chew on new rear hydraulic tensioner shoe.
Now I know
Tourer
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 259
Likes: 1
From: Kansas City, MO
BLAH BLAH BLAH!! Run the SS 510 gear drive setup. It'll work just fine. If you haven't been seriously hot rodding your bike now, your crank is FINE!! Alot of guys here don't know older harleys. Your bike came stock with Timken bearings on the crank. Those DONT give! I bet you're perfectly within stock spec. 510 is a great came for stock 88" motors. Keep it cheap and fun. Call a reputible shop for advise if needed or check runout if you've drank enough Koolaid....
Grand HDF Member
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 4,624
Likes: 189
From: Newcastle, Ca.
A high lift cam will not work with your stock 01 heads. 06 and newer heads, no problem. This thread was hijacked so not sure who is responding to whom....
Andrews 26's for your 88" imo. Runnin 21's in an 88", prefer the tq lower for hills, mountains and 2up riding. Go with chain tensioners. You have 47k miles on your 01 tensioners. Thats 11 years if service, hard to justify the large extra expense.
Andrews 26's for your 88" imo. Runnin 21's in an 88", prefer the tq lower for hills, mountains and 2up riding. Go with chain tensioners. You have 47k miles on your 01 tensioners. Thats 11 years if service, hard to justify the large extra expense.
HD Forum Stories
The Best of Harley-Davidson for Lifelong Riders
6 Weirdest Harley-Davidsons Ever Sold to the Public
Verdad Gallardo
7 Times Harley-Davidson Chucked Tradition Out the Window
Verdad Gallardo
7 Surprising Harley-Davidson Products that Are Not Motorcycles
Verdad Gallardo
8 Best Harley-Davidson Motorcycles Ever
Pouria Savadkouei
10 Worst Harley-Davidson Motorcycles Ever
Pouria Savadkouei
Killer Custom's Jail Break Is The Breakout That Refused to Blend In
Verdad Gallardo
Crazy Bunderbike Build Looks Amazing, But Is It Impossible to Ride?
Verdad Gallardo
Harley-Davidson Reveals Super Cool Cafe Racer Concept
Verdad Gallardo
Engraved Rebellion: Inside Bundnerbike's Glam Rock II
Verdad Gallardo
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,006
Likes: 1,240
From: On the Front Range, CO
Thanks so much for this info Redbeard!!! Exactly what I've been wondering ..how do I upgrade that camplate/tensioners AND the rear chain to a roller! No way I'm going to spend the time and $$ doing the upgrade and leave that Morse link style chain to chew on new rear hydraulic tensioner shoe.
Now I know
Now I know
Grand HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,998
Likes: 655
From: bklyn,ny
BLAH BLAH BLAH!! Run the SS 510 gear drive setup. It'll work just fine. If you haven't been seriously hot rodding your bike now, your crank is FINE!! Alot of guys here don't know older harleys. Your bike came stock with Timken bearings on the crank. Those DONT give! I bet you're perfectly within stock spec. 510 is a great came for stock 88" motors. Keep it cheap and fun. Call a reputible shop for advise if needed or check runout if you've drank enough Koolaid....