FP3 for 2012s
Road Warrior
Joined: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,926
Likes: 193
From: ohio
I know 3 others, and myself that use the FP 3 on Rushmore touring bikes, and everyone is very happy. Customer service is always available, Iv'e only used the customer service to ask questions , and double check, but always very helpful
Road Warrior
Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,937
Likes: 320
From: Vancouver, WA
V&H products and support is THE BEST that I've experienced with any aftermarket manufacturer. Like I said before, if I had it to do over again I'd do it again the same, no questions asked.
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,586
Likes: 175
From: Los Lunas, NM
I would like to shed some light on ! rock103 !'s situation. I prefer the whole story be told and allow the readers make their own determination.
Unfortunately ! rock103 ! had another issue which the dealership deemed a problem caused by the FP3. His bike would not start. He flashed the bike back to the original map (Slot 0) and it still would not start. The bike was operating on the original map that was flashed from the factory. However, he was told that a Twin Cooled map was flashed into his ECM(his is air cooled). Which is not possible for the FP3 to do. First and foremost it would not start on the stock map (Slot 0), which is a dead give away that something else was wrong unrelated to the FP3. However, I will explain why the FP3 is not capable of flashing a map that does not apply to specific VIN designation.
It is not possible because we decipher the bikes VIN before first flashing the bike. Our server is based on the VIN and have a database of over 3,000 maps. There is a checksum in place that protects the FP3 from flashing a map that does not apply to a bike. The values of the original map must add up to the same amount, otherwise it will not allow you to proceed. An air cooled map does not have the same table size, thus the checksum is different.
As we all know, dealer's unfamiliar with an aftermarket product will use it as a scapegoat to charge the customer more money without fully disclosing why or how. So they re-flashed it again and charged him. So out of the sake of customer service and ! rock103 !'s happiness, I extended the offer of a refund. However, because we do not deal direct the credit process takes time. We issue a credit to the distributor, then the distributor issues a credit to the dealer, which then the dealer issues the credit to the consumer. And this takes time. The refund process began on April 6th BTW. Most dealers will issue a credit right away without waiting for the distributor, but that is dependent on each dealer.
At the end of the day, we at V&H did everything in our power to help ! rock103 !, but sometimes things are out of our control. We pride ourselves on a quality product and only the best customer support that we can offer. If anyone has any questions, they can always contact me directly at cneely@vanceandhines.com
Unfortunately ! rock103 ! had another issue which the dealership deemed a problem caused by the FP3. His bike would not start. He flashed the bike back to the original map (Slot 0) and it still would not start. The bike was operating on the original map that was flashed from the factory. However, he was told that a Twin Cooled map was flashed into his ECM(his is air cooled). Which is not possible for the FP3 to do. First and foremost it would not start on the stock map (Slot 0), which is a dead give away that something else was wrong unrelated to the FP3. However, I will explain why the FP3 is not capable of flashing a map that does not apply to specific VIN designation.
It is not possible because we decipher the bikes VIN before first flashing the bike. Our server is based on the VIN and have a database of over 3,000 maps. There is a checksum in place that protects the FP3 from flashing a map that does not apply to a bike. The values of the original map must add up to the same amount, otherwise it will not allow you to proceed. An air cooled map does not have the same table size, thus the checksum is different.
As we all know, dealer's unfamiliar with an aftermarket product will use it as a scapegoat to charge the customer more money without fully disclosing why or how. So they re-flashed it again and charged him. So out of the sake of customer service and ! rock103 !'s happiness, I extended the offer of a refund. However, because we do not deal direct the credit process takes time. We issue a credit to the distributor, then the distributor issues a credit to the dealer, which then the dealer issues the credit to the consumer. And this takes time. The refund process began on April 6th BTW. Most dealers will issue a credit right away without waiting for the distributor, but that is dependent on each dealer.
At the end of the day, we at V&H did everything in our power to help ! rock103 !, but sometimes things are out of our control. We pride ourselves on a quality product and only the best customer support that we can offer. If anyone has any questions, they can always contact me directly at cneely@vanceandhines.com
Last edited by ! rock103 !; Apr 15, 2016 at 05:28 PM.
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,586
Likes: 175
From: Los Lunas, NM
Oh and btw, the FP3 will void warranty and you will pay out of pocket for any problems related to ECM, BCM and FP3 installation. And uninstalling it if and when you take it in won't do you any good, because they can see the map that is flashed so there is that. Something to consider taking a risk on...
Road Captain
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 565
Likes: 152
From: Calgary, Alberta
Oh and btw, the FP3 will void warranty and you will pay out of pocket for any problems related to ECM, BCM and FP3 installation. And uninstalling it if and when you take it in won't do you any good, because they can see the map that is flashed so there is that. Something to consider taking a risk on...
Fact, the dealer or manufacturer cannot legally void warranty unless they can determine the damage was related to the installation of the device.
Fact, I fought that fight and lost, unless I wanted to retain a lawyer take it to the next level. The dealer denied a bad injector and did that on the weight that Chrysler denied the claim. The tuner manufacturer went to bat and informed that the injector could not be damaged with the tuner or the tune. Chrysler and the dealer stood fast. Long story short, you are correct in that, unless you want to go the distance, they will turn their backs on you and there's sweet FA to be done about it.
OTOH, it's extremely unlikely a tuner will damage your ECU or BCM. Used improperly it may be possible to damage mechanicals though. That said, we pretty much run the same risk if we change most anything without the manufacturer's permission. They could, in fact, deny a warranty claim if you changed the header and air cleaner and had valve issues, for instance. It could happen.
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,586
Likes: 175
From: Los Lunas, NM
I ran the same risk flashing my diesel truck.
Fact, the dealer or manufacturer cannot legally void warranty unless they can determine the damage was related to the installation of the device.
Fact, I fought that fight and lost, unless I wanted to retain a lawyer take it to the next level. The dealer denied a bad injector and did that on the weight that Chrysler denied the claim. The tuner manufacturer went to bat and informed that the injector could not be damaged with the tuner or the tune. Chrysler and the dealer stood fast. Long story short, you are correct in that, unless you want to go the distance, they will turn their backs on you and there's sweet FA to be done about it.
OTOH, it's extremely unlikely a tuner will damage your ECU or BCM. Used improperly it may be possible to damage mechanicals though. That said, we pretty much run the same risk if we change most anything without the manufacturer's permission. They could, in fact, deny a warranty claim if you changed the header and air cleaner and had valve issues, for instance. It could happen.
Fact, the dealer or manufacturer cannot legally void warranty unless they can determine the damage was related to the installation of the device.
Fact, I fought that fight and lost, unless I wanted to retain a lawyer take it to the next level. The dealer denied a bad injector and did that on the weight that Chrysler denied the claim. The tuner manufacturer went to bat and informed that the injector could not be damaged with the tuner or the tune. Chrysler and the dealer stood fast. Long story short, you are correct in that, unless you want to go the distance, they will turn their backs on you and there's sweet FA to be done about it.
OTOH, it's extremely unlikely a tuner will damage your ECU or BCM. Used improperly it may be possible to damage mechanicals though. That said, we pretty much run the same risk if we change most anything without the manufacturer's permission. They could, in fact, deny a warranty claim if you changed the header and air cleaner and had valve issues, for instance. It could happen.
Last edited by ! rock103 !; Apr 15, 2016 at 06:12 PM.
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,586
Likes: 175
From: Los Lunas, NM
Another point of fact is I was getting ignored and or the run around on these issues until I posted in another thread on the forum some time ago. Then Chris finally stepped in and began offering assistance.
Last edited by ! rock103 !; Apr 15, 2016 at 06:04 PM.
Road Captain
Joined: Jul 2015
Posts: 565
Likes: 152
From: Calgary, Alberta
If I understand you correctly, you had tuned the ECM and then HD did an ECU update? If that's the case then I can see things getting "out of sync" , as it were. I know this is a way different scenario but with my truck I absolutely need to return to stock before an ECU update, otherwise I can have the same situation as you. Then when I reload the tune, the new stock tune is stored in "slot 0". This is one of the drawbacks to actual ECU tuning as opposed to just adding a fuel manager. It is possible you may have had the same issues with a PCV. Can't say for sure as it is a different scenario, but it's possible. It's an unfortunate problem you had. I've leaned on V&H for help before and they have treated me right in the past. OTOH I know someone got into a losing battle with Dynojet over a PCIII, so I suppose it can happen.
Best of luck with the Harley tune.
Best of luck with the Harley tune.
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Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,372
Likes: 250
From: NW Kentucky
All that said I still believe the FP3 has a pretty solid track record. All tuners are going to have problems and nay sayers. It's an electronic device not much unlike your common cell phone and you know the issues with those. I'll stick with my FP3 for now and maybe down the road I'll just get a real dyno tune. But that will involve cams and maybe some head work.
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 5,926
Likes: 138
From: NE Ohio
I ran the same risk flashing my diesel truck.
Fact, the dealer or manufacturer cannot legally void warranty unless they can determine the damage was related to the installation of the device.
Fact, I fought that fight and lost, unless I wanted to retain a lawyer take it to the next level. The dealer denied a bad injector and did that on the weight that Chrysler denied the claim. The tuner manufacturer went to bat and informed that the injector could not be damaged with the tuner or the tune. Chrysler and the dealer stood fast. Long story short, you are correct in that, unless you want to go the distance, they will turn their backs on you and there's sweet FA to be done about it.
Fact, the dealer or manufacturer cannot legally void warranty unless they can determine the damage was related to the installation of the device.
Fact, I fought that fight and lost, unless I wanted to retain a lawyer take it to the next level. The dealer denied a bad injector and did that on the weight that Chrysler denied the claim. The tuner manufacturer went to bat and informed that the injector could not be damaged with the tuner or the tune. Chrysler and the dealer stood fast. Long story short, you are correct in that, unless you want to go the distance, they will turn their backs on you and there's sweet FA to be done about it.