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Just to be clear, I know and understand countersteer. My father taught me about it when he taught me to ride 30 years ago. It was the comment that one doesn’t move the front wheel when pushing the bars on the highway that I was pointing out as wrong.
Yes, I agree. The wheel has to turn to turn the bike on just about all commercial motorcycles. Different bikes handle a little differently depending on the frame and fork design, but in most cases, the bike is designed to go back to zero turn when no pressure is applied, at least at road speeds. Also, at slow speed, a rider can turn a bike without counter steering simply by leaning into the turn to counter centrifugal force. That is how many riders ride a bicycle. They just don't realize it.
My one contribution to the discussion is that wider the bars, the more reach is required from the rider and that can affect how the hands use the clutch and throttle. A lot of riders will comment that turning one direction is easier than the other direction. That is generally because their hands struggle more controlling the clutch or throttle in a turn because of the reach and angle change. Beach bars are the extreme of putting the hands in challenging angles, either too close, or too far away. Which is why I don't have beach bars anymore.
For the guys that want to 'split hairs', yes, the wheel turns. There will be a fraction of a degree of movement in the steering head to get the frame dip, varying with speed (more speed, less movement).
For the guys that want to 'split hairs', yes, the wheel turns. There will be a fraction of a degree of movement in the steering head to get the frame dip, varying with speed (more speed, less movement).
Split hairs? OK, I guess in a physics sort of way.
The steering angle is depended on BOTH the turn radius AND speed. So, MORE SPEED actually REQUIRES MORE movement in the same turn radius.
What is this frame dip you are talking about. Do you mean turn dip?
Dip - lean over, lean into
It's all been discussed in this thread.
Yea, it still doesn't make sense. Dip is term used to maximize a full lock turn. But I don't see how it is used here. Certainly doesn't factor into the handlebars part of the discussion.
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