Uh, okay. I guess it could be an honest mistake. OTOH my cynical side says that he might have sent the stockers thinking "Maybe he won't know the difference and I'll re-sell the 255's later. If he does notice it, I'll act apologetic and jump through my **** to get him the right cams and maybe still get a good feedback rating. It's a good gamble!"

Anyway, at least you're getting the correct part this time around--hopefully. It's just that you are the third guy on this forum alone who's purchased 255's and reported being sent the wrong cams. In one other case the seller was very apologetic and bent over backwards to right the wrong, but you still have to wonder.

 

This feels like what's happening. I'm not getting detonation....but at higher temps I'm pinging when I roll on the throttle. I think it's a combination of things.

1) the map Jamie sent me is exactly what I asked for, a stage 1 103. Turns out what I asked for isn't what I needed as I have the cam and accompanying ECM download.

2) I have made no changes to the timing area of the map because until it got hot yesterday, I hadn't really had much trouble.

3) I was running up to 14.6 AFR's in the cruise range. I went in and dropped them to 14.4

4) Once heat becomes an issue the ECM may be in fact retarding my timing even more, leading to pinging and reduced performance.

I think the CAT headpipe has a lot to do with it as well due to the heat build-up. Once I get the new map and headpipe I think all will be well

One thing consistently different in your strategy from mine is that you run a rich base map with lean AFR's in the AT. I have never tried this. I am a convert to your method of thinking and will be hooking up a switch. I think this would have helped me out a bit.

I do have a cooler and I was only in traffic briefly. But I was running it pretty damn hard off and on for a while. Hey we ride to have fun right.

Absolutely, and when your in the throttle like I was, head temps are probably out climbing oil temps by two fold. This is one time I wish I had data logging capability. Damn if I'm paying another $300 for the cool little LCD screen for the PCV though.

 

I know...I thought the same thing. I guess I'm a sucker and choose to think the majority of folks out there still mean well even when their actions don't reflect it. I'm waiting for the new box to come and will probably start a poll just to see what everyone thinks I should do with the feedback.

Do you mind sharing which members? I'd like to contact them to find out what the seller's name is.

 

Hey, you're hardly a sucker. You bought an item on Ebay in good faith like all of us do, and doing that invokes a certain amount of faith the seller is honest. They usually are, but obviously not always.

I don't remember the names, just that I read it somewhere here, and not that long ago. I took a stab at a search and found "texas speed freak" who bought some 203's that turned out to be stockers, so maybe that was one. I recall at least one other who bought 255's and were similarly cheated, but I couldn't find them using the limited search engine here.

 

You've just illustrated why I use a TTS and not a PC with a generic map. I can control timing, as well as how much I want the timing pulled if there's detonation. The PC is a piggypack unit, so it's not letting the PCM do it's job properly (it's either sending altered data to the ECM or it's sending altered data to the injectors). On top of that, the OP was running a generic map rather than tuning to his bike (what are the parameters for autotune, 5%?), and he was running a stage 1 rather than a stage 2, which means he wasn't adding enough fuel and/or the timing wasn't right.

Again, not slagging anyone or their products, but generic maps are for generic bikes. They don't take into account your riding environment, your gas quality, or any quirks of your bike (is the compression in both of your cylinders the same?). The TTS allows you to data log and see exactly what the bike is doing when you ride it. If you're getting detonation, it shows you where. And it also allows you to keep the factory knock sensor so you don't grenade your motor.

To the OP, I know it's gotten to be in style to blame the catalyst for all the bike's ills, but I think you'll be very happy with the way it runs once you get the proper map in it.

 

The PCV is also capable of controlling timing, either in both cylinders simultaneously, or in separate tables for each cylinder. I didn't because I didn't know I was having issues till it got hot the other day. But I can.

Different methods of accomplishing the same task if you ask me. A lot of TTS guys use this without really being able to explain the benefits of having the signals sent directly from the ECM. As long as the injectors and timing are doing what they are told to do, what difference does it make where the signal comes from???

Not true. I STARTED with a generic map, yes. PCV with AT allows +250 to -100 adjustment in total deviation from the ECM map. I had my AT set at 20% which would allow up to 20% trims to the PCV base map. By choosing to accept the trims they become part of the PCV basemap. Further trims with the AT lead to a basemap that is highly tuned to my bike. What isn't automatic...in any tuning device...is the timing adjustments. All the big name tuners are fully capable of modifying timing, but none are automatic. I didn't play with the timing because I would rather go ahead and start with a closer basemap now that I know it wasn't right. I do agree however that my timing probably was not right...or my bike just didn't like the 14.6 AFR's I was telling it to tune to. I can fix both very easily.

The ECM does this and the PCV doesn't detract from the ECM's ability to utilize the MAP, Knock, and other sensors in the Delphi system. PCV also addresses timing and fuel for each cylinder separately.

This would be a very nice feature. Detonation and pinging are pretty easy to identify, but it would be nice to know exactly where. I hear the LCD screen for the PCV has data logging capability, but I have no idea what information is available.

Sorry, but the CAT in the headpipe is probably the single biggest problem I have right now. It leads to heat buildup in the motor very quickly and once the cylinder head temps reach a certain point and the ECM retards timing it wouldn't matter what tuning device I was using. Performance goes to the crapper at that point. Remember, all of my problems occur when my oil temps are over 230 degrees. I would like to know what my head temps were at that point, but I can tell you I was in the throttle pretty hard. With the restrictive CAT headpipe where is all that heat going? Building up in the heads I would guess. Once I get rid of the cat and see if I require any timing changes I'll report back my findings.

 

You can buy a pretty decent infared, hand held heat sensor for around $20 to check head temps pretty easily.

Dennis

 

That's interesting that the AT will allow such a big swing in adjustments. IIRC, the Thundermax only allows 5%. As far as I'm concerned, you're asking for trouble with a piggyback controller. I'm curious though, without datalogging, how can you accurately adjust timing?

I still think that there's something wrong somewhere that's causing you to lose power, and from my experience with a bike with a converter, I don't think that's it.

 

I had forgotten about these...looks like I need one for the toolbox.

The PCV software has the capability to display cylinder head temps. The problem is, by the time you pull over, start-up the laptop, open the software, and connect to the PCV....well, head temps have either come way down (shut down motor), or gone way up (idling).

For troubleshooting purposes an infrared thermometer would probably be more effective. Of course I would still pull over to use it, cause I'm no daredevil. Worth a shot though to aid in diagnosis...

 

There was a thread somewhere where a guy actually used one of those while riding to check his head temperatures.....That's a little extreme.