The MoCo
Banned
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,097
Likes: 0
From: Macon GA
Boats - motorcycles = apples - oranges.
Around my neighborhood there are alot of motorcycles and very few boats. I live in a gated community with a large lake. An even larger lake is a couple miles away.
The middle class is not going to have the buying power that they have had the last 2 decades. That was the lions share of HD sales. Middle class Americans, not the wealthy.
My wife and I saved thousands by buying an 08 Fat Bob and an 09 EGS. HD didnt make 1 cent off us.
Look on Craigslist and ebay. Used HDs far outnumber any other brand. Back in 99 a buddy wanted a new Sporty. He went into the dealer every morning looking for that months allocation to hit the floor. Now I can walk into nearly any dealer and pick a new bike off the floor any day of the month.
New bikes arent selling well, theres a glut of used bikes on the market.
Around my neighborhood there are alot of motorcycles and very few boats. I live in a gated community with a large lake. An even larger lake is a couple miles away.
The middle class is not going to have the buying power that they have had the last 2 decades. That was the lions share of HD sales. Middle class Americans, not the wealthy.
My wife and I saved thousands by buying an 08 Fat Bob and an 09 EGS. HD didnt make 1 cent off us.
Look on Craigslist and ebay. Used HDs far outnumber any other brand. Back in 99 a buddy wanted a new Sporty. He went into the dealer every morning looking for that months allocation to hit the floor. Now I can walk into nearly any dealer and pick a new bike off the floor any day of the month.
New bikes arent selling well, theres a glut of used bikes on the market.
Banned
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,097
Likes: 0
From: Macon GA
Maybe thats why they quit putting "Made in USA" on the seat.
Road Warrior
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,406
Likes: 5
From: Sunnyvale, Ca.
Harley sells bikes to dealers...Delaers to public...Public to public...
Harley / Harley Dealer will make money from every Harley Part, Oil, Clothes that you will buy....
Unless you own a Honda, Victory or some other bike Harley got your money
Elite HDF Member
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,780
Likes: 69
From: Al Bu Ker Key, New Mexico
BMCGC, would you please post your source for the following statements you made?
"Made in America? According to the Federal Trade Commission, more than 51% of the parts on a HD are made overseas. Its more like "Assembled in America".
" Under FTC rules HD is not an American manufacturer of MCs."
I would also like to know what motorcycle brand you currently own/ride, or if you even own/ride at all. You seem to have a lot to say about something I am not sure you know anything about.
"Made in America? According to the Federal Trade Commission, more than 51% of the parts on a HD are made overseas. Its more like "Assembled in America".
" Under FTC rules HD is not an American manufacturer of MCs."
I would also like to know what motorcycle brand you currently own/ride, or if you even own/ride at all. You seem to have a lot to say about something I am not sure you know anything about.
Road Master
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 954
Likes: 3
From: Broken Arrow, Oklahoma
I'm a member but have never asked for or gotten anything from them but a patch, pin and a road atlas with Harley dealers listed when I renew. I've been to a couple of rallys in the past and they pretty much sucked. I'm not much on clubs but I DO like the garage decorations they provide.
Banned
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 1,097
Likes: 0
From: Macon GA
BMCGC, would you please post your source for the following statements you made?
"Made in America? According to the Federal Trade Commission, more than 51% of the parts on a HD are made overseas. Its more like "Assembled in America".
" Under FTC rules HD is not an American manufacturer of MCs."
I would also like to know what motorcycle brand you currently own/ride, or if you even own/ride at all. You seem to have a lot to say about something I am not sure you know anything about.
"Made in America? According to the Federal Trade Commission, more than 51% of the parts on a HD are made overseas. Its more like "Assembled in America".
" Under FTC rules HD is not an American manufacturer of MCs."
I would also like to know what motorcycle brand you currently own/ride, or if you even own/ride at all. You seem to have a lot to say about something I am not sure you know anything about.
I currently own an FLHT, my wife owns and rides a FXDF.
Ive had a MC endorsement since 1974.
Ive owned @ 30 MC's so far.
If you dont like my data, do some research and prove me wrong.
How about you?
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Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,364
Likes: 33
From: So Cal The Golden State
I doubt the future is quite that dark.
How many guys do you know who own big boats? Boats that cost more than Harleys? It's a bad economy, sure, and lots of people are hurting, and sales could logically be expected to have suffered big declines. But sales of big boats are still being made.
Plus, as outlined in this and other similar threads, lots of dealers over-extended and upgraded during 2003-2007, and that might now seem to have been such a good idea now.
But if there are any segments of our economy where life is going better than average, it is in the areas where people with lots of disposable income continue to spend.
Boat sales have slowed down, but plenty of people nationwide are doing quite well thanks very much, and expensive boats continue to be sold.
Harley will be around for quite awhile. It might have to adjust to lower sales numbers for a few years, or re-tool, relocate, etc., but there is a pretty good market for Harleys and there will be into the future so long as the MoCo continues to manufacture motorcycles that people want to ride.
There will always be a segment of the market that can afford $25K-$35K+ motorcycles, and I suspect that thats the market segment that the MoCo will aim for in the future. Its far more 'recession-proof'.
YMMV.
How many guys do you know who own big boats? Boats that cost more than Harleys? It's a bad economy, sure, and lots of people are hurting, and sales could logically be expected to have suffered big declines. But sales of big boats are still being made.
Plus, as outlined in this and other similar threads, lots of dealers over-extended and upgraded during 2003-2007, and that might now seem to have been such a good idea now.
But if there are any segments of our economy where life is going better than average, it is in the areas where people with lots of disposable income continue to spend.
Boat sales have slowed down, but plenty of people nationwide are doing quite well thanks very much, and expensive boats continue to be sold.
Harley will be around for quite awhile. It might have to adjust to lower sales numbers for a few years, or re-tool, relocate, etc., but there is a pretty good market for Harleys and there will be into the future so long as the MoCo continues to manufacture motorcycles that people want to ride.
There will always be a segment of the market that can afford $25K-$35K+ motorcycles, and I suspect that thats the market segment that the MoCo will aim for in the future. Its far more 'recession-proof'.
YMMV.
Very well said. The only thing I can add to your comment is that the Marysville Ohio Plant was an assembly plant. The parts still came from Japan. But still, no one lost their job and that's because Honda is a very well run company and has competitive pricing. Harley on the other hand, as you said, is heading for disaster. I unfortunately bought into the whole HD hype as a lot of people do. I have learned my lesson. If I had to do it all over again, I would still be riding my paid for 06 Yamaha Roadliner. Don't get me wrong, my 2010 EGC is a very nice bike, but I could have spent a whole lot less on something very comparable. Your post is right on the money
Last edited by leicafish; Sep 30, 2010 at 05:51 PM.
