Tuning question
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Road Master
Joined: Aug 2008
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Tuning question
Will I get as good of a tune on my 04 without o2 sensors then with my 08 that has them, using the same tuner which would be a tts. I gues my question is more is it easier or harder to tune without o2 sensors.
Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Apr 2006
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From: Roswell, GA
First, I don't see how a bike can be tuned without measuring 02 using sniffer(s) up the muffler/header, or 02 sensors in the head pipe.
Second, it's pretty simple to install 02 bungs for installing 02 sensors on the older bikes like your '04. I removed my Rinehart headpipes from my '04 EG after marking where the bungs would go, and had a muffler shop weld on the bungs, then drilled the headpipes for the sensors. My friend is an expert tuner who uses the Daytona TwinTech Wego II (IRRC) that uses 02 sensors to collect data and it's much easier using the sensors than the sniffer tubes in the mufflers.
I'm not familiar with the TTS tuning system beyond the fact that TTS allows the ECM to be reprogrammed like the SERT and SEPRT.
Carl
Second, it's pretty simple to install 02 bungs for installing 02 sensors on the older bikes like your '04. I removed my Rinehart headpipes from my '04 EG after marking where the bungs would go, and had a muffler shop weld on the bungs, then drilled the headpipes for the sensors. My friend is an expert tuner who uses the Daytona TwinTech Wego II (IRRC) that uses 02 sensors to collect data and it's much easier using the sensors than the sniffer tubes in the mufflers.
I'm not familiar with the TTS tuning system beyond the fact that TTS allows the ECM to be reprogrammed like the SERT and SEPRT.
Carl
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Joined: Sep 2007
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From: Vancouver Island B.C.
Without sampling your afr it will be impossible to tune. If you have used vtune to tune your '08 bike and want to do the same to your '04 it's possible with some mods. You would have to upgrade to an '05 or newer ecm to allow closed loop. You would also have to add the o2 sensors to the bike. I believe there are kits available to do this, couple of sensors and some wire (the list of parts are listed at the end of the tuning guide). You could also just have your bike dyno'd the way it is. One of the big advatages to doing the upgrade is the ability to use MT7 calibrations, which are much better than the older MT6.
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: May 2008
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From: 'Noke, VA
Without sampling your afr it will be impossible to tune. If you have used vtune to tune your '08 bike and want to do the same to your '04 it's possible with some mods. You would have to upgrade to an '05 or newer ecm to allow closed loop. You would also have to add the o2 sensors to the bike. I believe there are kits available to do this, couple of sensors and some wire (the list of parts are listed at the end of the tuning guide). You could also just have your bike dyno'd the way it is. One of the big advatages to doing the upgrade is the ability to use MT7 calibrations, which are much better than the older MT6.
My '05 has O2 sensors added so I can V-Tune. Well worth it.
your answer is YES, when the bike is tuned on a dyno the operator turns the sensors off anyways. Sometimes turned back on when done,sometimes not. When they are turned on the bike will have the ability to make minor adjustments, when they are off the bike will not have the ability to make adjustments. Since your 04 doesn't have them on, it would be like a newer one that has them shut off, the bike will run whatever air fuel the operator calibrated it to. if you add bungs and add o2's to your bike, it wouldn't matter because the ECM is not set up to read them. they would work with a system, like PCV, that has autotune because the autotune modules read them not the ECM. Same thing for late model bikes that have the PC, the o2's are eliminated and the bike is running solely on the MAP
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Road Master
Joined: Aug 2008
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your answer is YES, when the bike is tuned on a dyno the operator turns the sensors off anyways. Sometimes turned back on when done,sometimes not. When they are turned on the bike will have the ability to make minor adjustments, when they are off the bike will not have the ability to make adjustments. Since your 04 doesn't have them on, it would be like a newer one that has them shut off, the bike will run whatever air fuel the operator calibrated it to. if you add bungs and add o2's to your bike, it wouldn't matter because the ECM is not set up to read them. they would work with a system, like PCV, that has autotune because the autotune modules read them not the ECM. Same thing for late model bikes that have the PC, the o2's are eliminated and the bike is running solely on the MAP
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 7,439
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From: 'Noke, VA
your answer is YES, when the bike is tuned on a dyno the operator turns the sensors off anyways. Sometimes turned back on when done,sometimes not. When they are turned on the bike will have the ability to make minor adjustments, when they are off the bike will not have the ability to make adjustments. Since your 04 doesn't have them on, it would be like a newer one that has them shut off, the bike will run whatever air fuel the operator calibrated it to. if you add bungs and add o2's to your bike, it wouldn't matter because the ECM is not set up to read them. they would work with a system, like PCV, that has autotune because the autotune modules read them not the ECM. Same thing for late model bikes that have the PC, the o2's are eliminated and the bike is running solely on the MAP
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