De-Catted 2011 Road Glide Ultra
Cruiser
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 165
Likes: 0
From: Daytona Beach
There are no reasonably priced 12mm wide-band 02 sensors hence the problem. All the closed loop tuning systems need a wide band. Haven't tried this yet, but it may be the solution. It's a 18mm to 12mm adapter.
http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/x...cat=250&page=2
Not liking the fact that the tip of the sensor is out of the exhaust stream, but for those who don't have dual bungs, or want to weld in 18mm bungs, it might be worth a try.
: EP
http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/x...cat=250&page=2
Not liking the fact that the tip of the sensor is out of the exhaust stream, but for those who don't have dual bungs, or want to weld in 18mm bungs, it might be worth a try.
: EP
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 8,039
Likes: 1,305
From: Jayhawk Country
This whole cross talk between O2 sensors still doesn't make sense to me. With the Cat installed both O2 sensors are before the catalyst and one O2 sensor sits in the protected area of the front pipe. So why are the exhaust gases any different if both the sensors are before the CAT either installed or removed? I'm not sure how this theory is either proven or dis proven other than someone saying it's a fact. What facts back up their claim other than he is a well known tuner? I'm just wanting to get my facts straight and don't want to hurt my motor over the price of a $450 head pipe. The bike seems to run fine.
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,437
Likes: 15
This whole cross talk between O2 sensors still doesn't make sense to me. With the Cat installed both O2 sensors are before the catalyst and one O2 sensor sits in the protected area of the front pipe. So why are the exhaust gases any different if both the sensors are before the CAT either installed or removed? I'm not sure how this theory is either proven or dis proven other than someone saying it's a fact. What facts back up their claim other than he is a well known tuner? I'm just wanting to get my facts straight and don't want to hurt my motor over the price of a $450 head pipe. The bike seems to run fine.
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 8,039
Likes: 1,305
From: Jayhawk Country
the cat keeps the negative pulses from carrying fresh air back up to the O2 sensors. remember while one pipe is pushing out exhaust the other side is pulling in fresh air which skews things. Many have not had problems but some have and Doc has a reputation that he does not bs if he says it is a problem, I believe him, I already had my cat removed and ready to go but decided against it after talking to him. I thought looking at it like one of the sensors was protected but what he said about the over size chamber made sense to me.
Tourer
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 492
Likes: 0
From: Castle Rock, CO
Boy, if I'm to believe everything I read here, "my friend's bike" shouldn't be running at all - a '10 Ultra Limited with Stage 1, HD SE slip-ons, SEST and dyno tuned at the 1,000 mile service. Spayed about 5,000 miles ago (23,000 on the odo), JetHot coated the header inside and out, and didn't bother to re-dyno cuz the tuner said he needed temps in the 50's to do it reliably. "Go ride it and come back in the spring"....
Bike runs cooler (though that could be cuz it's winter <g>), throttle has more snap, mileage hasn't been affected (except by crap winter gas), still pulls the hills here in Colorado (the ones that don't have snow on 'em). Doesn't surge, not hard to start (cold or hot), plugs not fouled.
Maybe he got lucky.
Bike runs cooler (though that could be cuz it's winter <g>), throttle has more snap, mileage hasn't been affected (except by crap winter gas), still pulls the hills here in Colorado (the ones that don't have snow on 'em). Doesn't surge, not hard to start (cold or hot), plugs not fouled.
Maybe he got lucky.
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 8,039
Likes: 1,305
From: Jayhawk Country
This is a response to an e-mail I sent to a well known company that does the CAT removal. I wont post the company info to protect them and myself. Here's what they said.
With or without the catalytic converter, the o2
sensors are kept completely separate from each other with interior tubing
that comes stock in the headers- each oxygen sensor is and continues to be
designated to an individual cylinder on the motor with or without the
catalytic converter. There are no issues with cross talk what so ever, this
idea probably sprang up from how automobile exhausts have an o2 sensor on
each side of the cat- therefore removing the cat causes crosstalk between
the two. In these motorcycles, the o2 sensors both fall before the catalytic
converter, so no cross talk issue exists. Please let us know if you have any
additional questions. Thanks again.
With or without the catalytic converter, the o2
sensors are kept completely separate from each other with interior tubing
that comes stock in the headers- each oxygen sensor is and continues to be
designated to an individual cylinder on the motor with or without the
catalytic converter. There are no issues with cross talk what so ever, this
idea probably sprang up from how automobile exhausts have an o2 sensor on
each side of the cat- therefore removing the cat causes crosstalk between
the two. In these motorcycles, the o2 sensors both fall before the catalytic
converter, so no cross talk issue exists. Please let us know if you have any
additional questions. Thanks again.
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,437
Likes: 15
This is a response to an e-mail I sent to a well known company that does the CAT removal. I wont post the company info to protect them and myself. Here's what they said.
With or without the catalytic converter, the o2
sensors are kept completely separate from each other with interior tubing
that comes stock in the headers- each oxygen sensor is and continues to be
designated to an individual cylinder on the motor with or without the
catalytic converter. There are no issues with cross talk what so ever, this
idea probably sprang up from how automobile exhausts have an o2 sensor on
each side of the cat- therefore removing the cat causes crosstalk between
the two. In these motorcycles, the o2 sensors both fall before the catalytic
converter, so no cross talk issue exists. Please let us know if you have any
additional questions. Thanks again.
With or without the catalytic converter, the o2
sensors are kept completely separate from each other with interior tubing
that comes stock in the headers- each oxygen sensor is and continues to be
designated to an individual cylinder on the motor with or without the
catalytic converter. There are no issues with cross talk what so ever, this
idea probably sprang up from how automobile exhausts have an o2 sensor on
each side of the cat- therefore removing the cat causes crosstalk between
the two. In these motorcycles, the o2 sensors both fall before the catalytic
converter, so no cross talk issue exists. Please let us know if you have any
additional questions. Thanks again.
Road Master
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 795
Likes: 1
BS. Take off a gutted pipe and see where the O2 are located and the angle of the exhaust flow that disrupts the accuracy of the other O2 sensor. There are problems with cross talk and inaccurate readings. The cat acts like an airfoil that straightens the airflow for proper readings. Removed and there is havoc on 2010+ models. Either get a new header pipe with proper O2 sensor placement further down the stream in separate header tubes with 12 mm bungs or stay catted with heat.
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Tourer
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 496
Likes: 20
From: Chardon, Ohio
the cat keeps the negative pulses from carrying fresh air back up to the O2 sensors. remember while one pipe is pushing out exhaust the other side is pulling in fresh air which skews things. Many have not had problems but some have and Doc has a reputation that he does not bs if he says it is a problem, I believe him, I already had my cat removed and ready to go but decided against it after talking to him. I thought looking at it like one of the sensors was protected but what he said about the over size chamber made sense to me.