XIED OR TUNER ? again
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Cruiser
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 151
Likes: 0
From: bay area, california
XIED OR TUNER ? again
I have read alot of threads about both of these options, but what is not clear to me is the power increase between a tuner or xieds. i have a 2011 road glide custom 103 with kerker stout 4" slip ons and plan on a a/c upgrade. Thats it im not going to do cams or other performance mods. I still have the stock head pipe with the cat, i like the sound i have now and the heat does no bother me like others, so i plan on keeping it as is. So what power increase if any would i get from going with a tuner or would xieds to the job for a simple stage 1 setup?
Extreme HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 14,744
Likes: 402
From: Phoenix '53, '88, '09 Big Twins
xieds just make the mixture a little richer--- under most operating situations, cruising at steady speeds etc.
tuners offer all kinds of options ( they advertise) and maybe are super-awesome.
i use xieds- there are posts everyday from guys having tuner problems---AND the xieds just plug in, if you have to go in for a warranty claim, you just unplug them. A tuner in place may violate the warranty.
I doubt that you slip ons would do much for power increase alone.
the popular "stage 1" is about allowing more flow in and out of the motor, with these restrictions removed expect gain of 7 to 10 horsepower--- it is the least expensive gain you'll ever see.
part of the restriction to flow is the cat- with it in place, it is doubtful that you would get benefit from air cleaner, tuner/xieds or slip ons.
mike
tuners offer all kinds of options ( they advertise) and maybe are super-awesome.
i use xieds- there are posts everyday from guys having tuner problems---AND the xieds just plug in, if you have to go in for a warranty claim, you just unplug them. A tuner in place may violate the warranty.
I doubt that you slip ons would do much for power increase alone.
the popular "stage 1" is about allowing more flow in and out of the motor, with these restrictions removed expect gain of 7 to 10 horsepower--- it is the least expensive gain you'll ever see.
part of the restriction to flow is the cat- with it in place, it is doubtful that you would get benefit from air cleaner, tuner/xieds or slip ons.
mike
Last edited by mkguitar; Sep 9, 2011 at 12:15 AM.
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 2,453
Likes: 667
From: Vancouver Island B.C.
Here's a 2011 RG, slip ons, SE Ventilator, TTS. Still has the cat. This is only showing the difference at wot. The bike was smoother, with more throttle response where you actually ride the bike. You have so much control with a good tuning device.
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,727
Likes: 6
Both the Xieds and the tuner give you more power by increasing the air/fuel mixture (AFR). Stock is set at about 14.7. That is very lean and gives poor performance and makes the bike run hot.
The Xied's are set at about 13.8 and give you a very noticeable increase in performance. For what you want, that is all you need. The Xieds are resistors with a connector at both ends, it changes the signal to the ECM and makes the ECM think it needs to adjust the AFR to keep it at 14.7 but in reality it is changing it to 13.8. It is not programming anything, it is just slight of hand for the ECM.
The tuner has a lot more options, some like the TTS actually reprogram the ECM, others like the PCV just change the signal the same as the Xieds, either way with a tuner you can do more than just change the AFR, but they cost a lot more and if you don't need those options then save your money and get the Xieds.
The Xied's are set at about 13.8 and give you a very noticeable increase in performance. For what you want, that is all you need. The Xieds are resistors with a connector at both ends, it changes the signal to the ECM and makes the ECM think it needs to adjust the AFR to keep it at 14.7 but in reality it is changing it to 13.8. It is not programming anything, it is just slight of hand for the ECM.
The tuner has a lot more options, some like the TTS actually reprogram the ECM, others like the PCV just change the signal the same as the Xieds, either way with a tuner you can do more than just change the AFR, but they cost a lot more and if you don't need those options then save your money and get the Xieds.
Outstanding HDF Member
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,023
Likes: 6
From: New Jersey
My goal is the same as yours: to add slip-on mufflers and a Stage I air kit. Since I, too, plan no further performance upgrades, I'm going with the Nightrider XiED kit for fuel management. The XiED kit will enrich the fuel supply enough to accommodate the increased air intake.
Regarding performance, it has been proven that noteworthy HP/torgue gains can be achieved by adding slip-on's, air kit and fuel management. Furthermore, all other things being equal, the difference in those gains, between cat-equipped Tourers and cat-free Tourers, is negligible.
Go for it!
Regarding performance, it has been proven that noteworthy HP/torgue gains can be achieved by adding slip-on's, air kit and fuel management. Furthermore, all other things being equal, the difference in those gains, between cat-equipped Tourers and cat-free Tourers, is negligible.
Go for it!
Road Master
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 812
Likes: 0
From: Jaw-Jaw (Near The BIG Chicken!)
XIED's - FL-VIED-10's - V&H Fuelpak LCD 61019
Just went down that road myself. Tried the XIED's, but wanted something more. Nightrider's website says the XIED's work well with the V&H Fuelpak, BUT found out NOT for 2011 bikes and up, 'cause the new Fuelpak LCD does not use o2 sensors (XIED's do). Got a MAP/cell adjustment from V&H Fuelpak tech Javi and couldn't be more pleased!! I (ME) can make the adjustments I want, not a $$$$$ dyno and a $$$$$ tuner. Not planning any internal engine work (If you are, go with SERT, TSS, Fuel Moto etc.). The V&H Fuelpak gets a bad rap on the forum sometimes, but IMHO I couldn't be happier! My 2011 RKC runs like a scalded dog!
Here you go:
Unit on the left is the new one for 2011 and up bikes:
http://www.fuelpakfi.com/vtwin/lcdportal.html
And to get your basic set-up (they'll do a personalized set-up for your tastes for FREE):
http://www.fuelpakfi.com/fplookup_lcd_revb.php
Here you go:
Unit on the left is the new one for 2011 and up bikes:
http://www.fuelpakfi.com/vtwin/lcdportal.html
And to get your basic set-up (they'll do a personalized set-up for your tastes for FREE):
http://www.fuelpakfi.com/fplookup_lcd_revb.php
Road Warrior
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,967
Likes: 18
From: Florida
Just installed Xieds in my 2011 RKC...did the stage one thing a while back. These little plug and play buggers really work. Almost felt like I had a 350 under the seat. No lag time at all. Been the tuner route but these seem to work well.
Don't have enough milage on them yet but I'll keep you posted.
Don't have enough milage on them yet but I'll keep you posted.
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Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 5,977
Likes: 85
From: Nevada
Just installed Xieds in my 2011 RKC...did the stage one thing a while back. These little plug and play buggers really work. Almost felt like I had a 350 under the seat. No lag time at all. Been the tuner route but these seem to work well.
Don't have enough milage on them yet but I'll keep you posted.
Don't have enough milage on them yet but I'll keep you posted.
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I have a fuel pak. It seems to work well once you know what each value represents and you adjust accordingly. I have a tuner for my mustang and it's great but the fuel pak is simple and easy. Anyone know how to raise the rev limit.
Road Captain
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 545
Likes: 5
From: California
I am gutting my cat next week on my 2011 103" RKC to cut down the heat and to help the bike breath easier. (Actually, I picked up a 103" exhaust system w/ only 400 miles on it off a '10 RG, headers through slip ons, off EBay for 150 bucks, shipped. I will be doing the changes to it and installing it to my bike.)
I have been wondering the same thing. XieD vs tuners. In particular the PCV. I, too, plan no further engine work. Just an AC and catless stock pipes. Maybe slipons at some future date. Until then... stock slipons.
I may be wrong, and some may agree with me about this, but, I just see no need for having the cat and a restrictive AC choking the engine.
So, this thread is of interest to me.
Are there other settings from a tuner that you need, will be helpful, beyond what a XeiD provides on a bike with only a Stage 1?
If I can adjust the bike with the XieD, and I expect that once done it will stay that way, I can not see the need for a tuner.
So, my .02 cents so I can be in on this tread.
I have been wondering the same thing. XieD vs tuners. In particular the PCV. I, too, plan no further engine work. Just an AC and catless stock pipes. Maybe slipons at some future date. Until then... stock slipons.
I may be wrong, and some may agree with me about this, but, I just see no need for having the cat and a restrictive AC choking the engine.
So, this thread is of interest to me.
Are there other settings from a tuner that you need, will be helpful, beyond what a XeiD provides on a bike with only a Stage 1?
If I can adjust the bike with the XieD, and I expect that once done it will stay that way, I can not see the need for a tuner.
So, my .02 cents so I can be in on this tread.
Last edited by Matt0987; Sep 9, 2011 at 06:40 PM.