Geared Cam versus Chain Drive
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Joined: Oct 2011
Posts: 68
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From: Bartlesville, OK
Geared Cam versus Chain Drive
I would like to add a geared cam to my nearly stock '06 Electra Glide Classic but need a better understanding of things to look for, along with any problems I might cause before I make a move. I've considered a 510G because its a "bolt-in" but the 585G has sounded interesting until I realized that compression should be increased among other things. I believe the 510G would be relatively mild, probably a lot like the original cam, while the 585G would be significantly more radical. Am I on the right road with my thoughts?
I am concerned that the previous owner has already replaced the billet plate, pushrods (with adjustable) hydraulic cam tensioner, and the oil pump with a high volume oil pump, and I would not like to repeat this (assuming that it this was caused by the old cam tensioner falling apart). I would like to increase the life and dependability of the bike while minimizing any potential problems.
Any thoughts, suggestions or insight into geared cams would be appreciated.
I am concerned that the previous owner has already replaced the billet plate, pushrods (with adjustable) hydraulic cam tensioner, and the oil pump with a high volume oil pump, and I would not like to repeat this (assuming that it this was caused by the old cam tensioner falling apart). I would like to increase the life and dependability of the bike while minimizing any potential problems.
Any thoughts, suggestions or insight into geared cams would be appreciated.
Road Captain
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 521
Likes: 3
From: Virginia
I'd say you are right on with your thoughts as far as the cams go. I'm not 100% sure but I think the only change you would have to make would be removing the hydraulic cam tensioner to go gear drive. The more experienced folks will chime in shortly.
I had a set of S&S 570G's installed in my 04 fatty and put on 55,000 trouble free miles since then. If your just looking to increase reliability I'd just do a cam swap. That is how I started. That adventure was short lived as quickly decided to make some other engine mods. After all was said and done I upgraded the jugs from 88" to 95", added high compression pistons, adjustable push rods, high performance heads with compression releases, race tuner and dyno tune. What a difference it made and the bike is tons of fun to ride. I was faced with the same decision as you but the cost to replace the cams was the same for the 510's as the 570's so I decided to go bigger. Somewhat costly but I'd do it again in a heartbeat.
I had a set of S&S 570G's installed in my 04 fatty and put on 55,000 trouble free miles since then. If your just looking to increase reliability I'd just do a cam swap. That is how I started. That adventure was short lived as quickly decided to make some other engine mods. After all was said and done I upgraded the jugs from 88" to 95", added high compression pistons, adjustable push rods, high performance heads with compression releases, race tuner and dyno tune. What a difference it made and the bike is tons of fun to ride. I was faced with the same decision as you but the cost to replace the cams was the same for the 510's as the 570's so I decided to go bigger. Somewhat costly but I'd do it again in a heartbeat.
Why bother swapping at this point? You have the upgraded tensioners. Unless it's cams you want; mine with 510G:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrLHC...8&feature=plcp
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrLHC...8&feature=plcp
Road Master
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 963
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From: Bellefonte PA
Yeah, if I'm reading your post right, and you're saying the previous owner already upgraded to the hydraulic tensioner setup, I would leave that system in place. I believe it should be very reliable, vs gear drive with the potential problem of excessive crank runout. If you want to swap cams, there are many choices available without going gear drive. I would pick the grind you like, and run the hydraulic tensioners. My two cents.
Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2011
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From: NorCal Rocklin
Yeah, if I'm reading your post right, and you're saying the previous owner already upgraded to the hydraulic tensioner setup, I would leave that system in place. I believe it should be very reliable, vs gear drive with the potential problem of excessive crank runout. If you want to swap cams, there are many choices available without going gear drive. I would pick the grind you like, and run the hydraulic tensioners. My two cents.
What is excessive crank runout that you talk about? I hear it alot but I dont understand what it means. Please explain.
Road Master
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 963
Likes: 1
From: Bellefonte PA
For gear drive cams the max allowable crank runout is .003. Anything more than that, which from what I understand is not uncommon on bikes newer than 2002, is not recommended for gear drive cams. As to what problems specifically it causes aside from gear whine noise, I don't personally know that much about. I am just going off what I have learned through researching my cam swap.
Club Member
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 45,429
Likes: 2,898
From: Bedford UK
The difference in alignment between the two shafts means that each shaft end describes a circle while it rotates, it doesn't spin on a perfect centre. That circle can be measured (it is usually a few thousandths of an inch) and is called runout.
Hope that helps!
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Sounds like the only thing you will gain with the gear cams is elimination of the cam tensionor ,you have the upgrade now ,why don;t you just go with a chain cam,there are many in the same range.much cheaper and just as dependable
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Stellar HDF Member
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 3,482
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From: NorCal Rocklin
The crankshaft is made up three main components, the two flywheels plus the crankpin assembly. Each flywheel has an integral shaft, one drives the primary, the other the cams. When the flywheels are assembled to the crankpin, it is almost impossible to get the two shafts in perfect alignment with each other.
The difference in alignment between the two shafts means that each shaft end describes a circle while it rotates, it doesn't spin on a perfect centre. That circle can be measured (it is usually a few thousandths of an inch) and is called runout.
Hope that helps!
The difference in alignment between the two shafts means that each shaft end describes a circle while it rotates, it doesn't spin on a perfect centre. That circle can be measured (it is usually a few thousandths of an inch) and is called runout.
Hope that helps!
Found the video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_ABd...yer_detailpage
Here is another link were you download the pdf file and shows a better veiw of how they check the runout
http://www.box.com/shared/u3l51lli0o
Last edited by vizcarmb; Feb 21, 2012 at 03:29 AM.
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Joined: Oct 2009
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From: Maryland near DC
and because of the runout the 2 gears (one on crank and one on cam), move closer and farther apart depending on crank position, so there is the potential for them to bind at their closest position (and to whine)