Hayden chain tensioner
Road Master
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,221
Likes: 4
From: Annemasse (border of Geneva-Switzerland) facing Mt-Blanc.
Waiting for a call back from Hayden about the shoe material, I'm going to stick with HDs recommendation of Formula + for now because of fretting issues with the compensator. I should have taken a pic of it before I installed, can't find a pic of the new style they must of sent. All machined, no welds. Much higher quality than any pics I've seen on their site or any adds. I'll get back when I find out the wear shoe material.
http://www.haydensm6.com/faq_M6BT07.html
Is there any initial break-in time?
<<... primary chain gliding over our nylon shoe ...>>
How long can I expect the SHOE to last?
<< As long as the correct lubricate is used in the primary case and the M6 is checked for wear every 20,000 miles, you should expect to have a long shoe life >>
Can you read between the lines?
Mineral oil, typically Formula + for both IPB cage and tensioner shoe
Tourer
Joined: Feb 2012
Posts: 303
Likes: 0
From: ontario, Canada
The answer is in their FAQ page:
http://www.haydensm6.com/faq_M6BT07.html
Is there any initial break-in time?
<<... primary chain gliding over our nylon shoe ...>>
How long can I expect the SHOE to last?
<< As long as the correct lubricate is used in the primary case and the M6 is checked for wear every 20,000 miles, you should expect to have a long shoe life >>
Can you read between the lines?
Mineral oil, typically Formula + for both IPB cage and tensioner shoe
http://www.haydensm6.com/faq_M6BT07.html
Is there any initial break-in time?
<<... primary chain gliding over our nylon shoe ...>>
How long can I expect the SHOE to last?
<< As long as the correct lubricate is used in the primary case and the M6 is checked for wear every 20,000 miles, you should expect to have a long shoe life >>
Can you read between the lines?
Mineral oil, typically Formula + for both IPB cage and tensioner shoe
How long will the M6 last?
"One of our first installations (over 13 years ago) now is approaching 600,000 miles on the M6. He has installed 3 primary chains during that time, but figures when you can get over 100,000 miles on a chain you are doing real darn good. AND, he's still on his first SHOE."
If you use something other then the "correct lubricant" what will ya get only 400,000 miles out a one, let's not over think it!
Road Master
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,221
Likes: 4
From: Annemasse (border of Geneva-Switzerland) facing Mt-Blanc.
Ya missed one!
How long will the M6 last?
"One of our first installations (over 13 years ago) now is approaching 600,000 miles on the M6. He has installed 3 primary chains during that time, but figures when you can get over 100,000 miles on a chain you are doing real darn good. AND, he's still on his first SHOE."
If you use something other then the "correct lubricant" what will ya get only 400,000 miles out a one, let's not over think it!
How long will the M6 last?
"One of our first installations (over 13 years ago) now is approaching 600,000 miles on the M6. He has installed 3 primary chains during that time, but figures when you can get over 100,000 miles on a chain you are doing real darn good. AND, he's still on his first SHOE."
If you use something other then the "correct lubricant" what will ya get only 400,000 miles out a one, let's not over think it!
The Nylon shoe will live longer than I will as long as its treated correctly.
The discussion was about the chemical resistance of polyamide when exposed to acidic degradation or ageing of synthetic oil doped with additives. This affects all component inside the primary trans.
Last edited by Expat1; Dec 6, 2012 at 03:13 AM.
Seasoned HDF Member
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 17,548
Likes: 7,201
From: Oxford, Nc
Mine just went passed 121,000 miles and there has been no appreciable wear on the nylon shoe beyond the initial wearing in. The side plates and the rollers all touch the nylon shoe simultaneously and the wearing just stopped.
I have always run Wal-Mart "Tech" 10W-40 or 20W-50 dino at $2.67 a quart (since I bought the bike in 2007 with 23,900 miles on her,) in the primary.
Just an observation: Has anyone noticed that the IPB failures seem to happen only to 6 speeds, never the earlier 5 speeds like mine? I personally think the IPB gets a bad rap on the newer bikes and the 6 speed just beats hell out of them because of poor design on the mainshaft supports. We keep looking for reasons as to why we have to replace compensators and IPB's and ring gears and deal with clink clank clink on hot restarts on the 07 and later. Just curious...
I have always run Wal-Mart "Tech" 10W-40 or 20W-50 dino at $2.67 a quart (since I bought the bike in 2007 with 23,900 miles on her,) in the primary.
Just an observation: Has anyone noticed that the IPB failures seem to happen only to 6 speeds, never the earlier 5 speeds like mine? I personally think the IPB gets a bad rap on the newer bikes and the 6 speed just beats hell out of them because of poor design on the mainshaft supports. We keep looking for reasons as to why we have to replace compensators and IPB's and ring gears and deal with clink clank clink on hot restarts on the 07 and later. Just curious...
Last edited by Stiggy; Dec 6, 2012 at 03:44 AM.
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 5,282
Likes: 2
From: Northwestern Nevada
Did you know that plastic cages are designed to operate in pure mineral oil at 80°C under continuous duty but disintegrate rapidly ( ̴2Y) when typical EP additives are mixed in the oil?
Many bearing manufacturers mention this in their specs, so the "one oil for all holes" argument could be incriminated in the serial failure of the IPBs.
Many bearing manufacturers mention this in their specs, so the "one oil for all holes" argument could be incriminated in the serial failure of the IPBs.
Crap
Road Master
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,221
Likes: 4
From: Annemasse (border of Geneva-Switzerland) facing Mt-Blanc.
Manufacturers who take time to inform their customers have lawyers waiting behind the door 
http://www.skf.com/portal/skf/home/p...newlink=1_4_11
Note
Single row cylindrical roller bearings with polyamide 66 cages can be operated at operating temperatures up to +120 °C. The lubricants generally used for rolling bearings do not have a detrimental effect on cage properties, with the exception for a few synthetic oils and greases with synthetic base oil as well as some lubricants containing a high proportion of EP additives when used at elevated temperatures.
http://www.skf.com/portal/skf/home/p...newlink=1_4_11
Note
Single row cylindrical roller bearings with polyamide 66 cages can be operated at operating temperatures up to +120 °C. The lubricants generally used for rolling bearings do not have a detrimental effect on cage properties, with the exception for a few synthetic oils and greases with synthetic base oil as well as some lubricants containing a high proportion of EP additives when used at elevated temperatures.
Ultimate HDF Member
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 5,282
Likes: 2
From: Northwestern Nevada
Manufacturers who take time to inform their customers have lawyers waiting behind the door
http://www.skf.com/portal/skf/home/p...newlink=1_4_11
Note
Single row cylindrical roller bearings with polyamide 66 cages can be operated at operating temperatures up to +120 °C. The lubricants generally used for rolling bearings do not have a detrimental effect on cage properties, with the exception for a few synthetic oils and greases with synthetic base oil as well as some lubricants containing a high proportion of EP additives when used at elevated temperatures.
http://www.skf.com/portal/skf/home/p...newlink=1_4_11
Note
Single row cylindrical roller bearings with polyamide 66 cages can be operated at operating temperatures up to +120 °C. The lubricants generally used for rolling bearings do not have a detrimental effect on cage properties, with the exception for a few synthetic oils and greases with synthetic base oil as well as some lubricants containing a high proportion of EP additives when used at elevated temperatures.
Road Master
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 1,221
Likes: 4
From: Annemasse (border of Geneva-Switzerland) facing Mt-Blanc.
That's not my goal and by far; I like to travel long distances and would not accept to be left stranded after having read about identified incompatibilities between materials.
Lets just get it right from the beginning and enjoy.
The Australian Maritime Safety Authority also published a document stating that ZINC ALKYL DITHIOPHOSPHATE (found in API/SG oils) does not conflict with Nylon; I buy this.
You can read this here on page 4 under "Storage suitable materials":
http://www.google.fr/url?sa=t&rct=j&...2HeMNHkGpiRMiA
Lets just get it right from the beginning and enjoy.
The Australian Maritime Safety Authority also published a document stating that ZINC ALKYL DITHIOPHOSPHATE (found in API/SG oils) does not conflict with Nylon; I buy this.
You can read this here on page 4 under "Storage suitable materials":
http://www.google.fr/url?sa=t&rct=j&...2HeMNHkGpiRMiA
Last edited by Expat1; Dec 6, 2012 at 06:21 AM.
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Road Warrior
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,993
Likes: 20
From: Southeast GA
I think this conversation got overthunk. Just replace the tensioner with the Hayden to get the proper slack in the chain and get on with your lives.
Last edited by vickers1; Dec 6, 2012 at 09:11 AM.
Road Warrior
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,514
Likes: 454
From: Canada
The Hayden makes sense to me. I'm surprised there aren't more spring style. But the ratcheting HD one, it has a spring as well doesn't it?
Neutral was a PITA, so that would be nice to get sorted as well.
H
Neutral was a PITA, so that would be nice to get sorted as well.
H